An unanswerable question

MOODYBLUE

BITTER,TWISTED,AND PROUD
I bought my first smiths album in 1984,aged 19.
I camped out,along with many others in1988,on a cold december night in wolverhampton,just to make sure i would get into the "civic hall" to see "the man".
3 decades later,my devotion to morrissey has never wavered {if i'm brutally honest it has increased over the years}
i was wracking my brain,thinking about any other person who has had such a level of devotion from so many people,for such a long period of time?????
Music changes....fads come and go,but morrissey remains a constant source of inspiration to millions.
Music and film stars only usually attain this level of adulation whaen they are dead !! {i.e james dean,elvis jimmy hendrix}
morrissey will always haa place in my heart,and my affection and thanks to him will never diminish.
Why has no one come close to morrissey in guiding,and helping me through the past 30 years ????
I look forward to hearing the thoughts of my fellow "family"members.
Best wishes to each and everyone !!!!
Keith.
 

realitybites

making lemonade
Subscriber
I bought my first smiths album in 1984,aged 19.
I camped out,along with many others in1988,on a cold december night in wolverhampton,just to make sure i would get into the "civic hall" to see "the man".
3 decades later,my devotion to morrissey has never wavered {if i'm brutally honest it has increased over the years}
i was wracking my brain,thinking about any other person who has had such a level of devotion from so many people,for such a long period of time?????
Music changes....fads come and go,but morrissey remains a constant source of inspiration to millions.
Music and film stars only usually attain this level of adulation whaen they are dead !! {i.e james dean,elvis jimmy hendrix}
morrissey will always haa place in my heart,and my affection and thanks to him will never diminish.
Why has no one come close to morrissey in guiding,and helping me through the past 30 years ????
I look forward to hearing the thoughts of my fellow "family"members.
Best wishes to each and everyone !!!!
Keith.

Morrissey is your god. A crutch. Something to cling to for comfort. Others have chosen Jesus over the years. Understand why humans have a need to create gods and you will have your answer.
 

Charlie Cheswick

Well-Known Member
I think Morrissey's greatest talent is expressing emotion through song, I'd argue he does this better than anyone else. Words and music go a long way but if they aren't pleasing on the ears... Plus, like what he says or not, there's a level of honesty there which is missing from most people. People mock him for spouting peasant politics from his mansion but the whole point is he never changed, he never sold out, he's still the same as he ever was. Just as some people got older their perceptions of him changed. The odd thing is that the kind of devotion he gets is usually synonymous with female fans yet his fanbase is broadly male.

I think the answers in there somewhere.
 

Anaesthesine

Angel of Distemper
I bought my first smiths album in 1984,aged 19.
I camped out,along with many others in1988,on a cold december night in wolverhampton,just to make sure i would get into the "civic hall" to see "the man".
3 decades later,my devotion to morrissey has never wavered {if i'm brutally honest it has increased over the years}
i was wracking my brain,thinking about any other person who has had such a level of devotion from so many people,for such a long period of time?????
Music changes....fads come and go,but morrissey remains a constant source of inspiration to millions.
Music and film stars only usually attain this level of adulation whaen they are dead !! {i.e james dean,elvis jimmy hendrix}

morrissey will always haa place in my heart,and my affection and thanks to him will never diminish.
Why has no one come close to morrissey in guiding,and helping me through the past 30 years ????
I look forward to hearing the thoughts of my fellow "family"members.
Best wishes to each and everyone !!!!
Keith.

It is a fascinating phenomenon.

In answer to your question: John Lennon had that kind of hold on people's hearts and minds during his lifetime. When he came out of "retirement" it was as if a mythical figure had stepped out of the ether. Had he not been murdered I'm sure that he would still command the same kind of fanatical affection. Had he toured in the '80s (as he had planned), I know that I would have been crying my eyes out in the front row.

Morrissey has a gift for musical intimacy that very few other singers can match. For his entire career he has gone to the darkest places, illuminated them, and given his audience a kind of catharsis. John Lennon did the same thing (especially in songs like "Mother"). It is something in the fierceness and fragility of the vocals, and the willingness to expose what most others (sensibly enough) keep hidden. It's a kind of musical bravery and the ability to bare all in the form of song. It's about vulnerability and swaggering bravado. Music is a kind of therapy (especially for artists like that), and so it is, in turn, for us.

Morrissey was also a great (and somewhat androgynous) beauty - a rather deadly combination in my opinion.
 
Last edited:

Chickpea

pithy yet degenerate
3 decades later,my devotion to morrissey has never wavered {if i'm brutally honest it has increased over the years}
i was wracking my brain,thinking about any other person who has had such a level of devotion from so many people,for such a long period of time?????

It's the same for me. I didn't discover Morrissey until a few years after you, but his place in my life is stronger now than its ever been. We're getting older together, Moz and me.

To answer your question, I would venture to say Robert Smith. As a longtime, hardcore fan of both Morrissey and the Cure, I can tell you from that side that the devotion and love shown toward RS, while expressed in very different ways than you see at a Morrissey show (for example), is on the same level. Whether or not you feel that way personally is another matter, but it's a very similar kind of enduring passion. Spend three hours at a Cure concert and you'll see what I mean…

I don't really like to draw too many parallels between Morrissey and Robert Smith (I'm sure neither of them want to draw parallels against the other either, haha), but they have not had dissimilar careers in terms of staying true to who they are and what they will and won't do for a dollar, and album sale, or an award. They are both outsiders to the core, and neither have ever seemed to care about the repercussions professionally. Sometimes this has worked well for them and sometimes it hasn't, but I am very happy and proud to be a fan of these guys who have been kicking around for quite a long time now without turning into parodies of themselves.
 

Anaesthesine

Angel of Distemper
So did David Koresh, Jim Jones, and Charles Manson.

Nope. These guys were religious hucksters (and Manson was an awful musician).

Lennon and Morrissey are first-rate artists: they have produced great music, and sing with conviction and vulnerability. That's as far as it goes.
 

realitybites

making lemonade
Subscriber
Nope. These guys were religious hucksters (and Manson was an awful musician).

Lennon and Morrissey are first-rate artists: they have produced great music, and sing with conviction and vulnerability. That's as far as it goes.

This was his question: "...any other person who has had such a level of devotion from so many people, for such a long period of time?????"

He never said they had to be musical artists. You inferred that. My answer is sound. And short. There are many, many more who could fit that bill. Osama bin Laden comes to mind.
 

Chickpea

pithy yet degenerate
In answer to your question: John Lennon had that kind of hold on people's hearts and minds during his lifetime. When he came out of "retirement" it was as if a mythical figure had stepped out of the ether. Had he not been murdered I'm sure that he would still command the same kind of fanatical affection. Had he toured in the '80s (as he had planned), I know that I would have been crying my eyes out in the front row.

Morrissey has a gift for musical intimacy that very few other singers can match. For his entire career he has gone to the darkest places, illuminated them, and given his audience a kind of catharsis. John Lennon did the same thing (especially in songs like "Mother"). It is something in the fierceness and fragility of the vocals, and the willingness to expose what most others (sensibly enough) keep hidden. It's a kind of musical bravery and the ability to bare all in the form of song. It's about vulnerability and swaggering bravado. Music is a kind of therapy (especially for artists like that), and so it is, in turn, for us.

I agree with all of this. I was born in 1975 so my earliest memories of John Lennon are sadly only of the chaos and sadness surrounding his death, but he holds a very special place in my heart all the same. I consider myself a John Lennon fan more than a Beatles fan. It's possible that this is because I am from New York (where John has been publicly enshrined by Yoko in a number of beautiful and visible ways), but for my entire life I've felt his presence all around me. He has now been dead for longer than he lived, but I think all the time about what he would have done lyrically and musically in the years going forward. What you said about vulnerability and fragility is so accurate, and I actually see a lot of that in Sean—a fantastic musician and lyricist in his own right.

Morrissey was also a great (and somewhat androgynous) beauty - a rather deadly combination in my opinion.

Was? Is. ;) Well, perhaps no longer androgynous, but as I said to someone just the other day—no one else looks like Morrissey. He is unbelievably beautiful, and in a very unusual way. I have met very few straight men and gay women who can deny that they, too, see Morrissey as an object of desire. He is for all of us, inside and out.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
"there's a level of honesty there which is missing from most people. "

what charlie said mr blue is correct for me as well. lots have talent, some have his, but no one takes the risk of being this honest. lydon did which is why i love him as well even when i often dont agree with him which is a lot. the risdk of being honest and embarrassed is one not many take so completely or on such a stage
 

Anaesthesine

Angel of Distemper
I agree with all of this. I was born in 1975 so my earliest memories of John Lennon are sadly only of the chaos and sadness surrounding his death, but he holds a very special place in my heart all the same. I consider myself a John Lennon fan more than a Beatles fan. It's possible that this is because I am from New York (where John has been publicly enshrined by Yoko in a number of beautiful and visible ways), but for my entire life I've felt his presence all around me. He has now been dead for longer than he lived, but I think all the time about what he would have done lyrically and musically in the years going forward. What you said about vulnerability and fragility is so accurate, and I actually see a lot of that in Sean—a fantastic musician and lyricist in his own right.

I'm a wee bit longer in the tooth than you, but I'm not old enough to remember the Beatles. I discovered John Lennon's music in grade school, and he had a gigantic impact on my life. His murder was of course devastating (I was teased about it in school because everyone knew what a big fan I was). I'm a New Yorker too - a family member has an office right opposite the Dakota. I regularly walk past the spot where John was murdered - oddly, it has become an unavoidable part of my life. Thank goodness for nearby Strawberry Fields - a beautiful (and necessary) oasis here in hectic NYC.

Was? Is. ;) Well, perhaps no longer androgynous, but as I said to someone just the other day—no one else looks like Morrissey. He is unbelievably beautiful, and in a very unusual way. I have met very few straight men and gay women who can deny that they, too, see Morrissey as an object of desire. He is for all of us, inside and out.

I knew someone would say that. :D

The thing I love about Morrissey's beauty is that it is self-willed: "Morrissey" is a beautiful creation on the part of SPM. Celebrity is the most powerful aphrodisiac (and a feedback loop): the more they love you, the more beautiful you become. I, too, know very few people who can deny that (at one of his many heights) Morrissey was radiantly beautiful.

This was his question: "...any other person who has had such a level of devotion from so many people, for such a long period of time?????"

He never said they had to be musical artists. You inferred that. My answer is sound. And short. There are many, many more who could fit that bill. Osama bin Laden comes to mind.

Yes, I inferred that from the context of the site and the conversation - this is about music. If you want to take that route, then Mahatma Gandhi and the late (and very great) Carl Sagan qualify as well.
 
Last edited:

realitybites

making lemonade
Subscriber
Yes, I inferred that from the context of the site and the conversation - this is about music. If you want to take that route, then Mahatma Gandhi and the late (and very great) Carl Sagan qualify as well.

My point was that musical artists are worshipped like gods. He wants to know why? My answer is that we must first understand why humans have a need to create gods to worship. My points are on topic, imo. Carl Sagan? Really? I guess Richard Dawkins would also qualify then. What about Steven Hawkings? Hunter S. Thompson? Mother Theresa?
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
This was his question: "...any other person who has had such a level of devotion from so many people, for such a long period of time?????"

He never said they had to be musical artists. You inferred that. My answer is sound. And short. There are many, many more who could fit that bill. Osama bin Laden comes to mind.

Wow. Why are you doing this? What are you accomplishing with this bullshit?
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
Perhaps you can answer the question. Why do humans create gods to worship? You worship many things. I think you might be able to shed some light.

I worship many things?
 

Anaesthesine

Angel of Distemper
Carl Sagan? Really? I guess Richard Dawkins would also qualify then. What about Steven Hawkings? Hunter S. Thompson? Mother Theresa?

Yes: Carl Sagan's name evokes awe and grateful nods in quite a few circles. Thanks in part to Neil DeGrasse Tyson, Saganism is now a thing. Steven Hawking - not yet. Hunter S. Thompson - nearly so (but he was an absurdist). Mother Theresa - Christopher Hitchen's campaign may have (thankfully) helped derail that train.
 

Roy Keane

New Member
Morrissey is your god. A crutch. Something to cling to for comfort. Others have chosen Jesus over the years. Understand why humans have a need to create gods and you will have your answer.

You've jumped to a silly conclusion. We don't live in a binary world. His adoration of Morrissey is within the same ilk as your adoration of Christopher Hitchens. And I'm sure you wouldn't like it if I said that he was your god, your crutch.
 
T

The Truth Seeker

Guest
I worship many things?

RealityBites - 21st Oct. 2006, aged 40 or thereabouts;

"It is OK to obsess over the man as well as the message. Atheists need a charismatic spokesperson to rally the troops. :)

I don't mind Dawkins being the man. Ever since Morrissey disappointed me this summer, I've been searching for a new hero. :D

Great interview."
http://old.richarddawkins.net/users/761/comments

You yourself could drag up many more instances of her hypocrisy if you were so disposed.

Move along folks, nothing to see here.

-The Truth Seeker.
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
Top Bottom