Lyrics You Don't Understand

"Poison pen" refers to "poison pen letters", which could be written and sent by anyone, not just journalists.

That line always reminds me of "So Hard" by the Pet Shop Boys where the little details (matches, contact magazine, mysterious mail) hint at a double-crossing couple's infidelities.
 
"And the songs we sing, they're not supposed to mean a thing".

I take this as being sarcastic. If you look at the song as a series of excuses that the hooligans use to justify their behaviour (eg. we're not really violent, it's just the turnstiles that make us so), this is the hooligan using the get out clause that the racist/abusive chants they use aren't meant to be taken seriously because "we're just having a laugh". The most obvious example is the "no surrender to the IRA chant". From the context Morrissey places it in it's clear he isn't buying the excuse though.
 
Here is how I read it: you have this segment of the population who spend their lives working and are miserable, jealous of the "Teaange Dad on His Estate." These same people attach meaning to their lives by giving themselves fancies titles, when in essence they are simply "cart horse providers." This was how the song was explained to me from someone from Ireland. I hope it helps your majesty!



Good idea for a thread. Maybe we can stick to vocabulary and idioms rather than in-depth analysis (some songs beg a million interpretations). I think that I Am Hated For Loving lyrics show a progression from the psychological, to emotional, to physical harm inflicted on someone (Moz) with a good heart. Why a "brick in the small of the back"? Maybe it happened to him.

I have a question I posted in the voting topic on Teenage Dad On His Estate.

I'm pretty up on Britishisms, but "dipper, slider"? Is this some sort of blue-collar reference? "Cart-horse provider" being like a bread winner? Is dipper slang for a painter and slider a carpenter or something?
 
We may seem cold,
Or we may even be
The most depressing people you've ever known.
At heart, what's left, we sadly know
That we are the last truly British people you'll ever know.
We are the last truly British people you will ever know.


from we`ll let know i heard this is about skinheads "We are the last truly British people you will ever know" i might be wrong
 
We may seem cold,
Or we may even be
The most depressing people you've ever known.
At heart, what's left, we sadly know
That we are the last truly British people you'll ever know.
We are the last truly British people you will ever know.


from we`ll let know i heard this is about skinheads "We are the last truly British people you will ever know" i might be wrong


I thought I read recently Morrissey talking about this, or someone else discussing it, possibly an old article, I can't remember when or where, but my take was that he was saying that his generation is the last truly British generation. With immigration and political correctness, etc, the British culture is changing and what is coming up now is not British in the true sense.

I can't remember where I got this idea from, can't remember the source...
 
We may seem cold,
Or we may even be
The most depressing people you've ever known.
At heart, what's left, we sadly know
That we are the last truly British people you'll ever know.
We are the last truly British people you will ever know.


from we`ll let know i heard this is about skinheads "We are the last truly British people you will ever know" i might be wrong

It's about football hooligans, hence the reference to turnstiles and the sound of the football crowd gradually descending into violence.
 
Here's mine...

When I first heard Our Frank, I thought Moz was singing about trying to escape from a vulgar person's car as in...
"you're frankly vulgar...
red (as in a traffic light) - pull over (as in pull the car over to the side of the road)"

When I finally saw the printed lyrics...
"your frankly vulgar red pullover"
I laughed out loud cause he was singing about someone's sweater.

However, it's the next line I don't get...
"now see how the colours blend" - what's that suppose to mean?

Joey
 
Here's mine...

When I first heard Our Frank, I thought Moz was singing about trying to escape from a vulgar person's car as in...
"you're frankly vulgar...
red (as in a traffic light) - pull over (as in pull the car over to the side of the road)"

When I finally saw the printed lyrics...
"your frankly vulgar red pullover"
I laughed out loud cause he was singing about someone's sweater.

However, it's the next line I don't get...
"now see how the colours blend" - what's that suppose to mean?

Joey

Three words for you:
Puke on sweater.

P.S. I freaking love this song. I forgive the entire album Morrissey all because of that song...
 
Thought it was a motorcycle?:confused:

Nope, 'tsacar. And not a bad looking one, at that.
photo.jpg


Looks little, but it's got a V8.

And "white trash Camaro"? Isn't that a tautology?
 
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could someone explain me this:
I entered nothing and nothing entered me
'Til you came with the key


*chuckles*
 
were there ever literally poison pen letters? that would be cool in an Alfred Hitchcock way. Send a letter to someone with poisonous ink.

I just didn't get the part about "get off the roof" in We'll Let You Know. The analysis of it at that site says

One of Morrissey's best-loved tunes, most mis-interpreted, and hence most controversial. Critics have a ridiculous tendency to selectively quote, and here's a fine example. Never mind the surrounding context, the critics can just pick out "we are the last truly British people you'll ever know" and thereby prove Morrissey's obvious xenophobia. Or not.
The song progresses from an intial state of typical Moz introspection. The indeterminate "we" is expanded into the community of football hooligans, thus placing the attitude expressed in the lyrics firmly out of Morrissey's personal beliefs. That such a forceful lyrical manoeuvre was purposefully ignored by his critics is rather ironic, as Morrissey rarely makes such a bold move in his more controversial songs.
Morrissey's ambivalent attitude towards the hooligans is a struggle between the cowardice of the people ("we will descend on anyone unable to defend themselves") and his beloved notion of a Lost Britain embodied in the fierce "patriotism" of the hooligans. As he says :

"I understand the level of patriotism, the level of frustration and the level of jubilance. I understand the overall character. I understand their agression and I understand why it must be released ... when I see reports on the television about hooliganism in Sweden and Denmark or somewhere I'm actually amused ... as long as people don't die, I am amused."

Finally at the end, the British character is revealed as someone "you'll never want to know". Seemingly intentionally tempting fate, this line is spoken half-obscured at the end of the song.
Some particularly haunting and unusual sound effects form the middle of the song, with the acoustic guitar providing the linking thread between the demure start of the song and the faux-apocalyptic finale.
 
were there ever literally poison pen letters? that would be cool in an Alfred Hitchcock way. Send a letter to someone with poisonous ink.

Hamlet had his own style of poison pen letters, as Rosencrantz and Guildenstern found out.

I just didn't get the part about "get off the roof" in We'll Let You Know.

I'll cut that Gordian knot by saying Morrissey doesn't actually sing those words.

If I'm wrong and he does say "Get off the roof", it means the same thing as "quit your complaining you miserable bastard", i.e., a sarcastic command to a suicidal person who's gone up on a roof to jump to his death to quit moaning and come in for supper. Same as "step back from the ledge", that sort of thing.
 
We may seem cold,
Or we may even be
The most depressing people you've ever known.
At heart, what's left, we sadly know
That we are the last truly British people you'll ever know.
We are the last truly British people you will ever know.


from we`ll let know i heard this is about skinheads "We are the last truly British people you will ever know" i might be wrong

It is partly a lament about British identity changing and homogenising, but if you listen very carefully to the end of the song he says 'never, never want to know' or something to that effect. i.e. when the footy hooligans are chanting and singing their pointless songs about being 'true Brits' you basically wouldn't want to know their version of Britain, as it means being a lout, like them.
That bit about 'get off the roof' signifies a riot, hence the musical interlude and whistles and the shouts, as in, 'come on lads, we're causing a scene'.
 
isnt the song about english football hooligans and their nonsensical chants? and it sort of follows the racist corners of society also highlighted in national front disco, saying that football fans have racist sects too, that think their true englishmen, who get drunk and cause riots at games? as for the "youre lonely..." part, i dont know!

Oh, and for our american friends, english footie isn't anywhere near as littered with hooligans the way it was in the 70's-early 1990's, but when you consider this album was written in 1992, it sort of makes sense. fits in with mozzer's fascination with suedeheads and boxers, east end gangsters etc.

Matt


yer absolutely right

because 'its the turnstiles that makes us hostile'

turnstiles are sorta iron gates, but they turn, one person per turn, most
handle 4 persons in 1 turn


[sorry bout the bad explain, blame me english teacher in the Netherlands]
 
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