Morrissey attacks 'blustering jingoism' of Olympic Games - Guardian 6 August

Worm

Taste the diffidence
Heh, yeah, exactly like them: Two events that are irrelevant to British history and says nothing meaningful whatsoever about British society. I can understand it when small, insignificant countries (such as my own) derive collective meaning from sporting triumphs, but you'd think a country like Britain could avoid making do with such desperate crutches. The infatuation with Diana and her pointless and trivial death is to me an absolute mystery. How can anyone regard that as "a defining moment in our history"? Why, what does it define? Your vulnerability to drunken chauffeurs? The extent of people's capacity for arbitrary sentimentality? The unconditional surrender to the gutter press' stranglehold on the national imagination? The pervasiveness of the Sissi syndrome?

::lbf::

Frankly I'm hard put to find anything very important at stake here, one way or the other. The Olympics, while phenomenally boring, doesn't do any harm

I haven't been following the matter closely enough, but there have been a few commentaries (like Owen Hatherley's) which make a case that the Olympics are a massive project to re-shape the city for economic reasons ("urban renewal"), and in particular to "open up" East London for investment. The other thing to point out is that the Games have allowed civic authorities to roll out even more invasive and all-encompassing security measures, many of which will remain in place long after the more visible elements-- troops and missiles-- have been removed. The Games aren't quite a traveling circus that will just up stakes and leave without a trace.
 

Lionel

New Member
Morrissey isn't complaining about 'jingoism' as he doesn't seem to know what it is, unless he's on some real acid trip about the games being linked to his crazy Malvinas Meme. :crazy:

'Siouxsie and Morrissey had a disagreement! You see, at the time, Morrissey was neck-deep in his fixation with the Union Jack and was intermittently having charges of racism flung at him for provocative songs like “Bengali in Platforms,” “The National Front Disco,” and “Asian Rut.” Apparently he wanted to use a bulldog as the central image for the promotional video. (Translation for American readers: this would be like Eddie Rabbit and Crystal Gale choosing to shoot a video for their song “You and I” in which they walk lovingly down a beach brandishing a rebel flag. You know, kind of.) This is where Siouxsie, who became infamous in her early punk rock fetish-wear days for wearing a swastika armband and had no desire to revisit that type of silliness, drew the line.

“The original video idea,” Siouxsie said, “was to show Ruth Ellis being led to the gallows, which I loved, but which didn’t happen. Instead he wanted a bulldog, which I didn’t understand. Why a bulldog? So I questioned him about his pro-British thing and told him I couldn’t have that. I said, ‘pick another dog, like a chihuahua or something. A monkey, anything!’ . . . I don’t know why he wanted to stick to his guns so much. And no, we’ve not spoken since.”

OMG, Siouxsie and Morrissey hate each other that’s so hot!! '

http://www.thenervousbreakdown.com/...issey-and-the-collaboration-that-time-forgot/

Siouxsie was :confused: Moz got all :mad: cuz she call it right 'n' kicked the :crazy: troll to the kerb. He was, like :tears: pissed cuz she said WTF has this

View attachment 13934

have to do with Youro's doomed diva fest? Absolutely nothing except another excuse to troll on.

regards

Maybe it was a cute bulldog? I wouldn't mind a cute bulldog.
 

Worm

Taste the diffidence
I love it. Morrissey has made them good and angry.
 
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Iona Mink

Despitemybetterjudgement
One of the common replies to anything Morrissey says (and it has risen its head again this time) is 'he doesn't live here so has no right to comment'. If he is not living here, where is he living these days?
 

Worm

Taste the diffidence
One of the common replies to anything Morrissey says (and it has risen its head again this time) is 'he doesn't live here so has no right to comment'. If he is not living here, where is he living these days?

Well, from the point of view of the British press, you can't make unflattering comments about the London Olympics if you're not actually from England because if you're not actually from England then how could you appreciate the magical spectacle of a border-effacing celebration of fabulous multicultural diversity if you no longer call London home...wait, now I'm confused.
 

Iona Mink

Despitemybetterjudgement
Well, from the point of view of the British press, you can't make unflattering comments about the London Olympics if you're not actually from England because if you're not actually from England then how could you appreciate the magical spectacle of a border-effacing celebration of fabulous multicultural diversity if you no longer call London home...wait, now I'm confused.

Indeed, that is why they say it but I've seen no evidence to suggest he is actually 'living' elsewhere. If they do suggest a place, it is information that is no longer correct eg The Sun has him currently living in Rome.
 

Worm

Taste the diffidence
Indeed, that is why they say it but I've seen no evidence to suggest he is actually 'living' elsewhere. If they do suggest a place, it is information that is no longer correct eg The Sun has him currently living in Rome.

I saw that. I didn't think anything of it. Just the habitual inaccuracy which makes its way into every single article or review about Morrissey. When was the last press item you read which didn't have some glaring mistake in it?
 
It can hardly be said that Morrissey is now 'irrelevant' when a brief statement he makes via a small website gets so much media attention. It's not like he gave an interview for a pape or anything.
 

CharlieFairhead

Loweringthetonesince1974
Billy Bragg puts his docs in:

"I'm sure no-one will be surprised to hear that Morrissey is in the wet blanket brigade when it comes to the Olympics, but I'm posting his comments here in an attempt to nail the charge of jingoism that has been levied by those who feel unco
mfortable at the flag waving joy that has accompanied our athlete's success.

Jingoism is defined by it bellicosity, by it's blinkered assertion that we are better than everybody else and you are rubbish because you are not us. I hate jingoism, but I don't feel that's the impulse behind the flag waving that I've seen. Yes, the home crowd are very enthusiastic when our athletes perform, but they've also shown a warmth towards those from other nations and not always the winners - witness the supportive response to Liu Xiang crashing out of the 110m hurdles this morning.

We've been conditioned over the years to associate any flag waving with nazism - as Mozzer does, breaking Godwin's Law in the process. But the truth is that the waving of flags is all to do with context.

When the British National Party do it, it symbolises their bellicose, divisive views. When Jessica Ennis does it, however, it speaks of a different society, one in which all can reach their full potential no matter what their background. When our fellow citizens wave their flags with her, I feel that they are expressing their pride in the possibility of that diverse, open society."
 

Worm

Taste the diffidence
Billy Bragg puts his docs in:

"I'm sure no-one will be surprised to hear that Morrissey is in the wet blanket brigade when it comes to the Olympics, but I'm posting his comments here in an attempt to nail the charge of jingoism that has been levied by those who feel unco
mfortable at the flag waving joy that has accompanied our athlete's success.

Jingoism is defined by it bellicosity, by it's blinkered assertion that we are better than everybody else and you are rubbish because you are not us. I hate jingoism, but I don't feel that's the impulse behind the flag waving that I've seen. Yes, the home crowd are very enthusiastic when our athletes perform, but they've also shown a warmth towards those from other nations and not always the winners - witness the supportive response to Liu Xiang crashing out of the 110m hurdles this morning.

We've been conditioned over the years to associate any flag waving with nazism - as Mozzer does, breaking Godwin's Law in the process. But the truth is that the waving of flags is all to do with context.

When the British National Party do it, it symbolises their bellicose, divisive views. When Jessica Ennis does it, however, it speaks of a different society, one in which all can reach their full potential no matter what their background. When our fellow citizens wave their flags with her, I feel that they are expressing their pride in the possibility of that diverse, open society."

Yet another example of people overestimating Morrissey's command of English.

Bragg knocks Morrissey's use of the word "jingoism", as if he had carefully chosen it. In the same TTY statement, Morrissey also wrote that the royals have "hi-jacked the Olympics for their own empirical needs", which is nonsense. What he really meant to write was "their own imperial" needs.

It's clear from the context of the statement that Morrissey was sickened by the branding of the London Games, the gigantic wave of hype and advertising swallowing up the sort of "authentic, good" patriotism Bragg eloquently describes, and not the "bellicosity" of the fans.
 

BrummieBoy

BrummieBoy
Billy Bragg puts his docs in:

"I'm sure no-one will be surprised to hear that Morrissey is in the wet blanket brigade when it comes to the Olympics, but I'm posting his comments here in an attempt to nail the charge of jingoism that has been levied by those who feel unco
mfortable at the flag waving joy that has accompanied our athlete's success.

Jingoism is defined by it bellicosity, by it's blinkered assertion that we are better than everybody else and you are rubbish because you are not us. I hate jingoism, but I don't feel that's the impulse behind the flag waving that I've seen. Yes, the home crowd are very enthusiastic when our athletes perform, but they've also shown a warmth towards those from other nations and not always the winners - witness the supportive response to Liu Xiang crashing out of the 110m hurdles this morning.

We've been conditioned over the years to associate any flag waving with nazism - as Mozzer does, breaking Godwin's Law in the process. But the truth is that the waving of flags is all to do with context.

When the British National Party do it, it symbolises their bellicose, divisive views. When Jessica Ennis does it, however, it speaks of a different society, one in which all can reach their full potential no matter what their background. When our fellow citizens wave their flags with her, I feel that they are expressing their pride in the possibility of that diverse, open society."

Spot on, Mr Bragg. When Morrissey is 'standing by the flag' that's ok, when anyone else is doing it in a way that he doesn't endorse/understand, whatever: they are BAD or STUPID people who aren't 'on message' with his bizarre 'interpretations' of British history and contemporary culture. Taxi for Morrissey, plane ticket to Zurich. End of.

regards
 

BrummieBoy

BrummieBoy
Yet another example of people overestimating Morrissey's command of English.

Bragg knocks Morrissey's use of the word "jingoism", as if he had carefully chosen it. In the same TTY statement, Morrissey also wrote that the royals have "hi-jacked the Olympics for their own empirical needs", which is nonsense. What he really meant to write was "their own imperial" needs.

It's clear from the context of the statement that Morrissey was sickened by the branding of the London Games, the gigantic wave of hype and advertising swallowing up the sort of "authentic, good" patriotism Bragg eloquently describes, and not the "bellicosity" of the fans.

Well, you won't see a follow-up statement from TTY accepting he was 'imprecise' in his use of language. Nothing is 'clear from the context' because Morrissey's use of language verges on incoherent. He is the mentally undersized one in this situation and like his insult to the Han Chinese famine cuisines, he now insults the civilisation of the San peoples of Africa without even realising he really, really is walking on thin ice:

http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2...-use-the-term-pygmy-when-speaking-of-pygmies/

If your 'business card' to the world says you are 'the only 'intelligent' pop star poet singer' you have to accept that people will probe your use of words. I come from working class England in the 70s. I sometimes screw up with language, and we're all on a journey balancing expression with education as to why certain words are problematic. Morrissey cannot say it's 'becuz of my poor edumacation' cuz he has the time and money to remedy that and has had 30 years to do so.

He is a troll. And his trolling has finally backfired spectacularly. The 'cult' will, of course, attempt to 'explain away' the latest foot-in-mouth but I think he's crossed the line this time. One would hope that the 'feedback' would trigger a personal and artistic reappraisal and even, a retraction. But, of course, that won't happen. He's too insecure to have a conversation. He just lobs his bombshells into the public domain and then scarpers. He is a troll. And a very bad one at that:

moz troll do not feed.jpg

Hopefully the 'autobiography' is ghost-written as he shows abysmal prose skills. I hope he will now stick to singing, writing lyrics and vocal melodies, and only making public statements that are 'screened' by a professional journalist or P.R team.

There's nothing 'controversial' or 'radical' in his views. Nothing.

regards
 

BrummieBoy

BrummieBoy
I saw that. I didn't think anything of it. Just the habitual inaccuracy which makes its way into every single article or review about Morrissey. When was the last press item you read which didn't have some glaring mistake in it?

If he wishes to comment further on British politics, current affairs and culture, Morrissey could usefully clarify whether or not he is, indeed, ex-pat for British tax purposes. If he's 'the last of the international playboys' and flits from luxury hotel to luxury hotel, that's nobody's business, unless he suggests some kind of 'loyalty' or 'commitment' to Britain that simply no longer exists. U2- from Dublin to Luxembourg, etc.

Is he just another ex-pat windbag who wants to complain about Britain. No doubt he will clarify. :rolleyes:

regards.
 

billybu69

Junior Member
Subscriber
What does, the lyric, "To be standing by the flag not feeling
Shameful, racist or partial" mean to everyone? I must admit I assumed national pride to be a positive thing, while the use of of the flag by rascist groups wrong. So why is national pride such a wrong thing today ten years on?
 

Mr Reynolds

Active Member
What does, the lyric, "To be standing by the flag not feeling
Shameful, racist or partial" mean to everyone? I must admit I assumed national pride to be a positive thing, while the use of of the flag by rascist groups wrong. So why is national pride such a wrong thing today ten years on?

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel ?
 

Worm

Taste the diffidence
What does, the lyric, "To be standing by the flag not feeling
Shameful, racist or partial" mean to everyone? I must admit I assumed national pride to be a positive thing, while the use of of the flag by rascist groups wrong. So why is national pride such a wrong thing today ten years on?

To me it means something like what Billy Bragg described.

Bragg was also right when he said "The truth is that the waving of flags is all to do with context". Part of that context is recognizing who's doing the flag waving, and why. It's obvious from Morrissey's statement that he blames-- if I may borrow a quaint old term-- the ruling class of England (the royals, the bankers) and their boot-licking lackeys (the press) for the pestilential atmosphere. "Foul with patriotism" means people cannot avoid being hit in the face with salvos of neoliberal ideology.

None of this wipes out the glory of the athletic competition itself or besmirches the national pride many English people are feeling. His complaint centers around the way the Olympics are relentlessly sold; with apologies to The Sex Pistols, "Your Olympics dream/Is a shopping scheme". I'm not English, but I remember Atlanta in '96, and in '12 I'm battered on a nightly basis by my own country's "patriotic" Olympics broadcasts, and I assure you I'm well well aware of what Morrissey's talking about. He isn't attacking the man in the street.
 
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