TTY: new photo by Sam Esty Rayner

Love and hate are different sides of the same emotion. Like a lover jilted and spurned, some of the most prominent members of this community have at some point been 'betrayed' by Morrissey. Maybe it's a cancelled show or something along those lines. They are trying to prove to themselves that they hate Morrissey when there's clearly some way to go to getting over it. This is more important to them than trying to spread hate to other people but when someone pays them attention - negatively or positively - it'll just seek to make them more determined to continue to eternal tirade.

That Morrissey has made some strange and often controversial moves in the last decade is not under question. People here have often been critical towards the guy's conduct, whether it affects them directly or indirectly. But those who used to love Morrissey will dwell on the same points over and over again like a mantra. The old 'why do you come here' question gets banded around and the answer is because Morrissey is still their dearest love. They're just trying to convince themselves that they're over it.

Do you really think that the only reason somebody might ruthlessly interrogate Morrissey's claims to artistic integrity and innovation is that they feel 'spurned' by him? And that, somehow, they still 'love' him? And are trying to hide that 'dearest love' by pretending to 'hate' him? Let me make my position clear. I do not 'love' Morrissey and never have. But I don't hate him either. What fascinates me is how somebody who is now clearly exposed as a charlatan and a careerist has managed to manage his image so adroitly over decades before finally bringing his alabaster crashing down with his absurd behaviour in recent weeks. I'm intrigued by this notion of 'community' which you posit. For years I've sketched out the idea that there exists his 'fans', many of whom are as disturbed and delusional as he clearly is and there is his 'audience' who experience similar feelings of enjoyment and catharsis from the songs and live performances but have never surrendered to any ludicrous notions of 'love' or 'adulation'. One can be a 'fan' of a pop culture figure until one is around 18, then one either becomes a member of the audience or joins Morrissey in the casualty ward.

Dignifying the repellent #ProfitFromParis email as merely 'strange and controversial' shows how unable you are to untangle yourself from your own emotional involvement and investment in his career. It is odd that you think you can analyse other's responses from such a position of Stockholm Syndrome entanglement. I also cannot see that the current debate about Paris is making the same points over and over again. The Boz email is spectacular proof of Morrissey's estrangement from consensual reality. And the most bizarre aspect is that he has provided the evidence that damns him. Other than an arrest for sex crimes, it's hard to imagine a more total humiliation. I will continue to critically monitor Morrissey's pubic career as, for me, it resonates beyond his own absurd clownish trolling. He has traded on Radical Outsider Art and Politics which was and is a formative influence in my life. What is now clear to me is that he is a pseud and a fraud but that doesn't mean he can't sing. One can only feel compassion for such a tragic person, trapped in a neurotic cul-de-sac of decreasing fame, surrounded by sycophants and mistaking the mutual dopamine rush of a good record or gig as 'love'. I cannot see this ending well for Morrissey. He will try to ignore it, as he did with Oslo and the 'Chinese sub-species' brouhaha, but this time it's different. The mask has slipped and only the truly disturbed could 'love' a specimen such as Morrissey who has clearly sought to exploit the death of 130 people for personal and career aggrandisement.

best
BrummieBoy
 
After really analyzing the pic, he actually had someone make those cuts in his right eyebrow, like all the "hip hop" singers and Justin Beaver. This is getting pathetic. The Morrissey Marketing Group Worldwide, LTD-Sherman Oaks-Malibu is ruining him now. I am going down there right now and giving Dale, Brennan, Kai, and Shilo a piece of my mind. Anonymous-
 
[Q
UOTE=g23;1986945284]I've got mine for May. I'm excited to buckle up for a 3 hour set.[/QUOTE]so


sounds like a nightmare.
 
Love and hate are different sides of the same emotion. Like a lover jilted and spurned, some of the most prominent members of this community have at some point been 'betrayed' by Morrissey. Maybe it's a cancelled show or something along those lines. They are trying to prove to themselves that they hate Morrissey when there's clearly some way to go to getting over it. This is more important to them than trying to spread hate to other people but when someone pays them attention - negatively or positively - it'll just seek to make them more determined to continue to eternal tirade.

That Morrissey has made some strange and often controversial moves in the last decade is not under question. People here have often been critical towards the guy's conduct, whether it affects them directly or indirectly. But those who used to love Morrissey will dwell on the same points over and over again like a mantra. The old 'why do you come here' question gets banded around and the answer is because Morrissey is still their dearest love. They're just trying to convince themselves that they're over it.



:thumb: EXACTLY ! thank you.
 
Do you really think that the only reason somebody might ruthlessly interrogate Morrissey's claims to artistic integrity and innovation is that they feel 'spurned' by him? And that, somehow, they still 'love' him? And are trying to hide that 'dearest love' by pretending to 'hate' him? Let me make my position clear. I do not 'love' Morrissey and never have. But I don't hate him either. What fascinates me is how somebody who is now clearly exposed as a charlatan and a careerist has managed to manage his image so adroitly over decades before finally bringing his alabaster crashing down with his absurd behaviour in recent weeks. I'm intrigued by this notion of 'community' which you posit. For years I've sketched out the idea that there exists his 'fans', many of whom are as disturbed and delusional as he clearly is and there is his 'audience' who experience similar feelings of enjoyment and catharsis from the songs and live performances but have never surrendered to any ludicrous notions of 'love' or 'adulation'. One can be a 'fan' of a pop culture figure until one is around 18, then one either becomes a member of the audience or joins Morrissey in the casualty ward.

Dignifying the repellent #ProfitFromParis email as merely 'strange and controversial' shows how unable you are to untangle yourself from your own emotional involvement and investment in his career. It is odd that you think you can analyse other's responses from such a position of Stockholm Syndrome entanglement. I also cannot see that the current debate about Paris is making the same points over and over again. The Boz email is spectacular proof of Morrissey's estrangement from consensual reality. And the most bizarre aspect is that he has provided the evidence that damns him. Other than an arrest for sex crimes, it's hard to imagine a more total humiliation. I will continue to critically monitor Morrissey's pubic career as, for me, it resonates beyond his own absurd clownish trolling. He has traded on Radical Outsider Art and Politics which was and is a formative influence in my life. What is now clear to me is that he is a pseud and a fraud but that doesn't mean he can't sing. One can only feel compassion for such a tragic person, trapped in a neurotic cul-de-sac of decreasing fame, surrounded by sycophants and mistaking the mutual dopamine rush of a good record or gig as 'love'. I cannot see this ending well for Morrissey. He will try to ignore it, as he did with Oslo and the 'Chinese sub-species' brouhaha, but this time it's different. The mask has slipped and only the truly disturbed could 'love' a specimen such as Morrissey who has clearly sought to exploit the death of 130 people for personal and career aggrandisement.

best
BrummieBoy

what you do here is 1000 times worst than anything Morrissey has ever said or done. the fact you can not see that makes you a
neurotic troll. anyway Ant and Dec are on .
 
Do you really think that the only reason somebody might ruthlessly interrogate Morrissey's claims to artistic integrity and innovation is that they feel 'spurned' by him? And that, somehow, they still 'love' him? And are trying to hide that 'dearest love' by pretending to 'hate' him? Let me make my position clear. I do not 'love' Morrissey and never have. But I don't hate him either. What fascinates me is how somebody who is now clearly exposed as a charlatan and a careerist has managed to manage his image so adroitly over decades before finally bringing his alabaster crashing down with his absurd behaviour in recent weeks. I'm intrigued by this notion of 'community' which you posit. For years I've sketched out the idea that there exists his 'fans', many of whom are as disturbed and delusional as he clearly is and there is his 'audience' who experience similar feelings of enjoyment and catharsis from the songs and live performances but have never surrendered to any ludicrous notions of 'love' or 'adulation'. One can be a 'fan' of a pop culture figure until one is around 18, then one either becomes a member of the audience or joins Morrissey in the casualty ward.

Dignifying the repellent #ProfitFromParis email as merely 'strange and controversial' shows how unable you are to untangle yourself from your own emotional involvement and investment in his career. It is odd that you think you can analyse other's responses from such a position of Stockholm Syndrome entanglement. I also cannot see that the current debate about Paris is making the same points over and over again. The Boz email is spectacular proof of Morrissey's estrangement from consensual reality. And the most bizarre aspect is that he has provided the evidence that damns him. Other than an arrest for sex crimes, it's hard to imagine a more total humiliation. I will continue to critically monitor Morrissey's pubic career as, for me, it resonates beyond his own absurd clownish trolling. He has traded on Radical Outsider Art and Politics which was and is a formative influence in my life. What is now clear to me is that he is a pseud and a fraud but that doesn't mean he can't sing. One can only feel compassion for such a tragic person, trapped in a neurotic cul-de-sac of decreasing fame, surrounded by sycophants and mistaking the mutual dopamine rush of a good record or gig as 'love'. I cannot see this ending well for Morrissey. He will try to ignore it, as he did with Oslo and the 'Chinese sub-species' brouhaha, but this time it's different. The mask has slipped and only the truly disturbed could 'love' a specimen such as Morrissey who has clearly sought to exploit the death of 130 people for personal and career aggrandisement.

best
BrummieBoy

Well, first of all who said my post was directly aimed at you? I didn't implicate any one user or identify any 'Anonymous' tropes in particular. But I could have been referring to anyone. It seems you've made a decision to quite urgently justify the nature of your contribution to this site.

Regardless of the love and hate argument, I think your reply as above optimises the role of the celeb-bating internet troll: you just want to upset the equilibrium... the internet is a wonderful tool for trying to do that because it provides a link into their lives via social media and internet forums where your comments are waiting to be read, and also because it offers total anonymity. It's the Noughties equivalent to the breather on the end of the 'phone.

I've made my thoughts on Paris known in other threads, should you care to read them. In terms of my connection to Morrissey and his music, I like to think that I judge each story posted on this site with the merit it deserves. I enjoy the music, and a small part of me is curious about the drama that is the present day Morrissey career. There is nothing to untangle in terms of my 'emotional involvement'; I admire him as an artist, I enjoy his music and I am fascinated by some of the enigma he even now continues to portray. And that's really it.
 
Last edited:
Well, first of all who said my post was directly aimed at you? I didn't implicate any one user or identify any 'Anonymous' tropes in particular. But I could have been referring to anyone. It seems you've made a decision to quite urgently justify the nature of your contribution to this site.

Regardless of the love and hate argument, I think your reply as above optimises the role of the celeb-bating internet troll: you just want to upset the equilibrium... the internet is a wonderful tool for trying to do that because it provides a link into their lives via social media and internet forums where your comments are waiting to be read, and also because it offers total anonymity. It's the Noughties equivalent to the breather on the end of the 'phone.

I've made my thoughts on Paris known in other threads, should you care to read them. In terms of my connection to Morrissey and his music, I like to think that I judge each story posted on this site with the merit it deserves. I enjoy the music, and a small part of me is curious about the drama that is the present day Morrissey career. There is nothing to untangle in terms of my 'emotional involvement'; I admire him as an artist, I enjoy his music and I am fascinated by some of the enigma he even now continues to portray. And that's really it.

Nowhere did I claim your post was only directed at me, that's why I wrote 'let me make my position clear'. If you do not specify an audience for a post you may expect to get a response from anybody who reads it. I have no need to justify the nature of my contribution to this site. It has been justified by events. You raised the issue of 'love' and 'hate' now your disregard it when your proposition and assumptions are challenged. Your attempt to dismiss me as a 'celeb-baiting internet troll' shows you have a covert agenda, you could simply have limited your reply to addressing the response I gave to your claims that those who challenge Morrissey are somehow grieving a loss of 'love'. Your description of the functionality of internet forums is redundant, everybody knows their purpose. However, you attempt to claim the moral high ground by dismissing those whose contributions you do not value as 'equivalent to the heavy breather on the end of the phone'. This is illogical and absurd. I have read your thoughts on Paris on other thread, if I had any comment to make on them I would have done so there.

If you think that Morrissey attempting to profit from the Parish Attacks is just 'some of the enigma he even now continues to portray' you are revealing a deep emotional investment in minimising the offensiveness of his current behaviour. I note you claim that others 'love' or 'hate' Morrissey but that you merely 'like' and 'admire' him. Yet you feel the need to label those who regard his behaviour as disturbed as 'trolls' or 'heavy breathers'. Perhaps you didn't realise the undertow of defensive anger in your choice of words. I'm sure upon re-reading them you can see that you are hardly neutral or objective. Some might take your original post as an attempt to troll and bait those who believe, like me, that trenchant criticism of Morrissey over these issues is entirely appropriate. I see it as yet another example of cognitive dissonance amongst his fan-base as they attempt to defend the indefensible and preserve their decades long investment in the mythical claims to him representing a genuine 'enigma' rather than what he is now clearly revealed as: a manipulative opportunistic careerist who has brazenly trolled the Paris Attacks to try to further his career. The joy of it all is that it has exploded in his face. That's it really.

best
BB
 
After really analyzing the pic, he actually had someone make those cuts in his right eyebrow, like all the "hip hop" singers and Justin Beaver. This is getting pathetic. The Morrissey Marketing Group Worldwide, LTD-Sherman Oaks-Malibu is ruining him now. I am going down there right now and giving Dale, Brennan, Kai, and Shilo a piece of my mind. Anonymous-

Yes, he is dressing like a skater dude. He has also recently discovered 'Fear Of A Black Planet' by Public Enemy so perhaps his 'rapping' in 'Neal Cassidy Drops Dead' is the first of many such adventures. I wonder what Nancy makes of it all?

best
BB
 
are there any pictures of an unshaven Morrissey?

Yes! He has shared his bum-fluff bare-arse with the public.

http://www.gigwise.com/news/40809/morrissey-bares-his-arse-to-the-public

best
BB

- - - Updated - - -

what you do here is 1000 times worst than anything Morrissey has ever said or done. the fact you can not see that makes you a
neurotic troll. anyway Ant and Dec are on .

Thank you for this compliment. Whenever one of his unhinged 'fans' lashes out it makes me realise how much more work there is to do to free those still captured in his 'cult'.

best
BB
 
what you do here is 1000 times worst than anything Morrissey has ever said or done. the fact you can not see that makes you a
neurotic troll. anyway Ant and Dec are on .

L O L !
Your not the sharpest tool in the box are you ?

Benny-the-British-Butcher
 
:thumb: EXACTLY ! thank you.

Awwwww ! Bless your cotton socks for putting your toe back in the water K S, I feel your pain ! I feel your shame ! Your not to blame !

Now then ! Silly Steven ! Trolling the Paris atrocities for self gain !

In your own time !

Thanks have a great wknd !

Benny-the-British-Butcher
 
I hate to use the cliche but the reason I've been coming here lately is because Morrissey has become the car crash I can't look away from. I've never been one of the people that wears his t-shirts or puts up his posters on the wall, but once upon a time his music did mean a lot to me. I do see in other people that they have a sense of ownership over some celebrities, and may feel betrayed when the relationship was all in their heads to start with. Even if Morrissey might encourage fan worship I don't hold him responsible for people thinking that they, or I, know him.

Anyone who visits any fan site is slightly odd, though. The music should be enough. I liked him and his music more before I ever had access to the Internet. I have learned a lot about him, on a surface level, and about his sources, and in some ways it might have helped me understand him more, maybe. Or maybe I just traded one illusion for another. But I used to listen to Smiths and then Morrissey long ago when a lot of what he was singing about were things I was going through and didn't have anyone to talk to about it. So I did have something of a distorted relationship to his records. I have been a fan of other bands and singers, but it was different with him. I know that sounds ridiculous. I guess I was part of "the cult" before I knew anyone else who even liked him.

I got mad about the "humasexual" nonsense, not because I "need him to be gay" but because it seemed like such a dumb and pointless lie. All you have to do is listen to the lyrics to figure out his sexuality, but whatever, we have already argued about this and maybe people need him to be what they need him to be. I think that the truth is that if he said he was gay a lot of his straight male fans would immediately jump ship, but whatever. I got over it. I don't care what he says about his sexuality. It doesn't change the songs or how I hear them and I'm not much interested in his personal life. I've never read any of those books about him, including his autobiography. I did not find it that interesting.

But the actions of the past few days are really fascinating to me, and maybe I do care because I am still a fan, and maybe irrationally, I do feel sort of betrayed. I do think it is about time for me to leave. I'm enjoying the discussions but soon it's just going to be the same old rehash and I don't have time to come here and write endlessly about it.

So, yes, tl;dr, blah blah blah, who cares, but that is "why I come here."
 
I like that, the idle hating the idol. Why do they come to a site dedicated to an artist they hate? Surely there are better targets for the wit and incisive comments provided by the likes of "bendy the butcher" and "Brummie Boy"....

I used to like Dairylea triangles. Now I don't. I don't talk about them incessantly or go to cheese forums purely to criticise. Get a f***ing life.

:thumb:
 
I hate to use the cliche but the reason I've been coming here lately is because Morrissey has become the car crash I can't look away from. I've never been one of the people that wears his t-shirts or puts up his posters on the wall, but once upon a time his music did mean a lot to me. I do see in other people that they have a sense of ownership over some celebrities, and may feel betrayed when the relationship was all in their heads to start with. Even if Morrissey might encourage fan worship I don't hold him responsible for people thinking that they, or I, know him.

Anyone who visits any fan site is slightly odd, though. The music should be enough. I liked him and his music more before I ever had access to the Internet. I have learned a lot about him, on a surface level, and about his sources, and in some ways it might have helped me understand him more, maybe. Or maybe I just traded one illusion for another. But I used to listen to Smiths and then Morrissey long ago when a lot of what he was singing about were things I was going through and didn't have anyone to talk to about it. So I did have something of a distorted relationship to his records. I have been a fan of other bands and singers, but it was different with him. I know that sounds ridiculous. I guess I was part of "the cult" before I knew anyone else who even liked him.

I got mad about the "humasexual" nonsense, not because I "need him to be gay" but because it seemed like such a dumb and pointless lie. All you have to do is listen to the lyrics to figure out his sexuality, but whatever, we have already argued about this and maybe people need him to be what they need him to be. I think that the truth is that if he said he was gay a lot of his straight male fans would immediately jump ship, but whatever. I got over it. I don't care what he says about his sexuality. It doesn't change the songs or how I hear them and I'm not much interested in his personal life. I've never read any of those books about him, including his autobiography. I did not find it that interesting.

But the actions of the past few days are really fascinating to me, and maybe I do care because I am still a fan, and maybe irrationally, I do feel sort of betrayed. I do think it is about time for me to leave. I'm enjoying the discussions but soon it's just going to be the same old rehash and I don't have time to come here and write endlessly about it.

So, yes, tl;dr, blah blah blah, who cares, but that is "why I come here."



As you say, "music should be enough" and "all you have to do is listen to the lyrics". There's a marketing/PR war out there, and some little battles are taking place here. You don't need to take part of it, you only need to be aware of its existence, because anything goes in war. Maybe you are not being betrayed, you are being fooled. Follow your heart.

I only care about the sexuality of the person who is actually having sex with me, because it's a private matter. Privacy is a human right: your sexual choice is yours until you decide to share it with the world. It's extremely rude to ask a person about his or her sexuality, so the answer "humasexual" seems extremely polite and kind compared to the answer that question actually deserves.
 
Nowhere did I claim your post was only directed at me, that's why I wrote 'let me make my position clear'. If you do not specify an audience for a post you may expect to get a response from anybody who reads it. I have no need to justify the nature of my contribution to this site. It has been justified by events. You raised the issue of 'love' and 'hate' now your disregard it when your proposition and assumptions are challenged. Your attempt to dismiss me as a 'celeb-baiting internet troll' shows you have a covert agenda, you could simply have limited your reply to addressing the response I gave to your claims that those who challenge Morrissey are somehow grieving a loss of 'love'. Your description of the functionality of internet forums is redundant, everybody knows their purpose. However, you attempt to claim the moral high ground by dismissing those whose contributions you do not value as 'equivalent to the heavy breather on the end of the phone'. This is illogical and absurd. I have read your thoughts on Paris on other thread, if I had any comment to make on them I would have done so there.

If you think that Morrissey attempting to profit from the Parish Attacks is just 'some of the enigma he even now continues to portray' you are revealing a deep emotional investment in minimising the offensiveness of his current behaviour. I note you claim that others 'love' or 'hate' Morrissey but that you merely 'like' and 'admire' him. Yet you feel the need to label those who regard his behaviour as disturbed as 'trolls' or 'heavy breathers'. Perhaps you didn't realise the undertow of defensive anger in your choice of words. I'm sure upon re-reading them you can see that you are hardly neutral or objective. Some might take your original post as an attempt to troll and bait those who believe, like me, that trenchant criticism of Morrissey over these issues is entirely appropriate. I see it as yet another example of cognitive dissonance amongst his fan-base as they attempt to defend the indefensible and preserve their decades long investment in the mythical claims to him representing a genuine 'enigma' rather than what he is now clearly revealed as: a manipulative opportunistic careerist who has brazenly trolled the Paris Attacks to try to further his career. The joy of it all is that it has exploded in his face. That's it really.

best
BB

secure your tongue, dude.
 

Trending Threads

Back
Top Bottom