For Britain's Anne Marie Waters thanks Morrissey in video message

ForgotHowIGotMyName

Well-Known Member
Is that justice?
z

ReelFountain, know I say this as someone who generally agrees with you and knows your heart is in the right place here.

I don't think Renshaw is a hill to die on. From what I read, Renshaw was claiming that all FOUR of his cell phones were hacked by Hope Not hate. That would have to have taken a government conspiracy because only intelligence agencies have that kind of technology.
Who knows? Maybe the government want an excuse to shut down National Action. But when you're dealing with a bunch of high-testosterone young men, it's inevitable someone is going to say or do something that crosses a line.

"Don't punch Right" is a good rule of thumb but defending the indefensible does not help the cause. The sad reality is that there are bad people on our side.
Fringe politics is a weird mish-mash of the best and the worst of humanity. To voluntarily become a social pariah (which is what you are doing if you get involved with Far Right politics), you have to either be highly principled and batshit crazy. Either you so strongly believe in the moral righteousness of the cause that you are willing to pay the huge social cost that goes along with standing up for it OR you are a sociopath. There are who get into white nationalism because, not in spite of, the fact that it is considered antisocial. They get off on being society's idea of "the bad guy".
And yes, the Left and the media lie a lot and it's easy to just get into the habit of just automatically believing the opposite if everything they say. But sometimes they get lucky and stumble upon something they don't have to lie about. The American Alt Right learned the hard way not to put blind faith in people just because they have all the right opinions.
 

reelfountain

On Timeout
z

ReelFountain, know I say this as someone who generally agrees with you and knows your heart is in the right place here.

I don't think Renshaw is a hill to die on. From what I read, Renshaw was claiming that all FOUR of his cell phones were hacked by Hope Not hate. That would have to have taken a government conspiracy because only intelligence agencies have that kind of technology.
Who knows? Maybe the government want an excuse to shut down National Action. But when you're dealing with a bunch of high-testosterone young men, it's inevitable someone is going to say or do something that crosses a line.

"Don't punch Right" is a good rule of thumb but defending the indefensible does not help the cause. The sad reality is that there are bad people on our side.
Fringe politics is a weird mish-mash of the best and the worst of humanity. To voluntarily become a social pariah (which is what you are doing if you get involved with Far Right politics), you have to either be highly principled and batshit crazy. Either you so strongly believe in the moral righteousness of the cause that you are willing to pay the huge social cost that goes along with standing up for it OR you are a sociopath. There are who get into white nationalism because, not in spite of, the fact that it is considered antisocial. They get off on being society's idea of "the bad guy".
And yes, the Left and the media lie a lot and it's easy to just get into the habit of just automatically believing the opposite if everything they say. But sometimes they get lucky and stumble upon something they don't have to lie about. The American Alt Right learned the hard way not to put blind faith in people just because they have all the right opinions.
Thanks for your interesting comment.

I remember the first time I saw an article about National Action I laughed. They had the banners, the uniforms... I just thought straight away: this is so obviously a faux group it's laughable. Hope Not Hate work with the intelligence agencies just like the Anti Nazi League and the Socialists etc used to with Gerry Gable. It's well known that Combat 18 back in the 90s was MI5 created. And they did this to round up lots of 'dangerous' people and to know what they were up to.

National Action was a new update for the social media age - and I say was because the very people who created it got it banned and its members prosecuted. It was a 'job' from beginning to end. Get a charismatic agent to round up some naive young radical right-wingers, encourage them, picture them with swastikas etc, provide all the gear, set them up, record everything... then press destroy and it creates lots of headlines to pretend that the far right is as dangerous as Radical Islam.

Are you aware that I have been saying this for quite a while - & do you agree or disagree (before I continue)?
 
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reelfountain

On Timeout
I'll continue anyway. All of them were obviously young and naive. One I know for a fact was a total f***-up that the papers recently delighted in writing about - Adam Thomas. He called his newborn child Adolf (according to the tabloids - in reality I think it was a middle name). He was pictured with his girlfriend holding swastikas etc. But what was revealed in a Jewish paper was that a year or two ago he was actually in Israel training to be an orthodox Jew but failed the training because of his anger issues. After that he presumably 'became a Nazi'. Who introduced and ensnared him into all this Nazi shit?

These kind of people - society's f*** ups - are who intelligence agencies always target for their faux groups, organisations and dirty work. The leader and informer of Combat 18 was such a freak he actually murdered another member while on the job.

I've never said Jack Renshaw was a nice person - (despite an Anon on here that has been trying to give this impression). What I have been saying is that he was obviously set up for his eventual downfall. And what a downfall - 20 years for saying he was going to do something. The real story is always murkier. I have a theory that he was blackmailed into being an informant for MI5 (because of his underage gay emails or something else, who knows). I've heard that MI5 agents are disproportionately gay - not hard to see why (they always have stuff on you). Gays have always been easy to blackmail. They got him to help set up NA and snare young members in, then when he was no longer needed (or became too dangerous) they turned on him.

He used to be in the BNP and I remember a couple of years back Nick Griffin actually said on Twitter: Hey Jack, stop ensnaring young idiots to your cause. They'll all eventually get arrested and you'll be to blame.
 
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Anonimust

Guest
f***ing great point. You, and the c*** that is Reelfountain, harp on how bad it is that we live in a multi-cultural society abd how mych you hate it. Both of you make many comnents on race/religion - ignorant, hateful comments but neither of you has ever had the balls to be absolutely straight and direct and said you hate: Muslims, black people and immigrants. This is were you state you don't - despite the fact you already have, consistently. This pathetic indirect pish is cowardice - why the hesitation? Step up and be counted with your friends on the alt-right and your martyr Jack Renshaw.

Neither of you ever will. You'll continue to spew venom in hiding like the cowards you are.

"f***ing great point"? You wrote the post that you're replying to, as your IP hash shows. So now you're reduced to replying to your own comments and cheering yourself on to make it seem like there are other anons who are backing you up. A couple of pages ago you wrote four posts in a row while trying to make a couple of those posts seem like they were written by different people.
I know you didn't realise that people with accounts can see the IP hash of anonymous posts, but we can. So we all have been able to marvel at just how desperate and pathetic you are. You really thought you'd get away with it! It's just one humiliation after another with you, isn't it. Back to school, junior!
 

reelfountain

On Timeout
"f***ing great point"? You wrote the post that you're replying to, as your IP hash shows. So now you're reduced to replying to your own comments and cheering yourself on to make it seem like there are other anons who are backing you up. A couple of pages ago you wrote four posts in a row while trying to make a couple of those posts seem like they were written by different people.
I know you didn't realise that people with accounts can see the IP hash of anonymous posts, but we can. So we all have been able to marvel at just how desperate and pathetic you are. You really thought you'd get away with it! It's just one humiliation after another with you, isn't it. Back to school, junior!
Couldn't have said it better myself. This person is an absolute imbecile.
 

ForgotHowIGotMyName

Well-Known Member
I have been saying this for quite a while. Are you aware of this & do you agree or disagree (before I continue)?

If you are saying that National Action was a government conspiracy from the begging, no, I don't believe that. National Action was sort of the British manifestation of the same zeitgeist that created the American Alt Right. It was an online community that spilled over into the real world.The fact is that any pro-white group that is open or even semi-open to the public is going to get infiltrated by feds. In the 1960's, 10% of the KKK were federal informants.

Now, I won't completely rule out a conspiracy because the British government has a long history of being shady. I'm not saying 0% chance conspiracy. But given the society and demographic changes, the explosion of the Alt Right and chan culture, and just generally the populist surge happening all over the West, it was inevitable that some people were going to start forming groups LIKE National Action.
If the government didn't create National Action, I assure you that someone else would have. Because it's happening all over the world. In America it looked like the Alt Right, in France it looks like the Yellow Vests, in Italy looked like Salvini, and in Britain it looked like National Action.
I don't doubt that National Action got infiltrated and became a de facto honey trap. I disagree that it was created specifically for that purpose. Maybe it was. Who knows? But it would not have become as popular as it did if it were not part of a larger zeitgeist.
 

reelfountain

On Timeout
A load of skint young people all dressed up in black uniforms with banners, flags of the NA logo etc... It was pure MI5 theatre. In England ordinary young people have no money to throw around. They were all being used. Not that they knew it of course. A single one or two would have been agents. I believe this 100% because this is MI5s MO. They've done it before!

The English perfected the spy game a good five hundred years ago in the days of Christopher Marlowe and Shakespeare. England was literally riddled with them. They like to create groups so they can spy on them. Or if not, spy on groups already there.

I don't think NA ever became very popular. It was always very small. But the tabloids talk about it as if it was a massive organisation. They talk about 'political meetings' that in reality were just drink-us in the local pub - a bunch of mates having a drink. It's quite hilarious how the whole thing has been overblown. Did he really salute in court or was it just a wave to his family. A wave is enough to fire up the imaginations of the British tabloids. Would Renshaw really have killed that MP? I don't believe so. I reckon he was advised to plead guilty to get a lesser sentence - going 'not guilty' might have got him 30 years.
 

ForgotHowIGotMyName

Well-Known Member
Both of you make many comnents on race/religion - ignorant, hateful comments but neither of you has ever had the balls to be absolutely straight and direct and said you hate: Muslims, black people and immigrants.

You know, you can be realistic about race and without hating other races.

If I say "On average, Chinese are shorter than Africans", does that mean I hate Chinese people? Or am I just stating an observable fact?
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Do you have any insight into why this may be the case, if indeed, it is the case? Could racism play a part. A racism that is currently being played out within this thread?
I'm sure you'd be better off asking a sociologist this question, but I'll give it my best shot.
I think it's socioeconomic status more than anything. The schools are shit, for example. I'm not saying that the system is racist in that regard, because a white person growing up in the same neighborhood with the same disadvantages wouldn't have any more of an opportunity than the black kids do.
I understand that what ReelFountain and the others are doing is acknowledging patterns, and I believe that should be done if there are patterns to be acknowledged.
On the other hand, it can be very difficult for a black boy growing up who feels like because of who he is, that's the kind of life he must lead. It becomes internalized.
Kids go into it quite young. High school kids start dealing for cash and the next thing you know, they're wrapped up in that world... then you see their face in the local paper and it's all very numbing.
My point is: yes, I do think racists who paint all black people as violent gangsters do, in the process, harm the black community. However, there's a problem that needs to be solved and nothing will change if we don't address it.

Hope my reply was satisfactory. Have a good one.
 

ForgotHowIGotMyName

Well-Known Member
A load of skint young people all dressed up in black uniforms with banners, flags of the NA logo etc... It was pure MI5 theatre. In England ordinary young people have no money to throw around. They were all being used. Not that they knew it of course. A single one or two would have been agents. I believe this 100% because this is MI5s MO. They've done it before!

National Action's logo
National_Action_UK_logo.jpg

Was based on Oswald Mosely's British Union of Fascists
628410669-mosley-speaks-for-peace-tonight-oswald-mosley-british-union-of-fascists-deployment.jpg


I dunno. I heard a podcast with the leader of National Action and he explained why they did the things they did. He said they were explicitly National Socialist because they didn't want people coming in and then trying to water down the message. So they made the bar very high: National Socialism or gtfo and that was to ward off the thin-skinned.

Also, you think National Action was an MI5 operation but that Renshaw, it's spokesman, wasn't? Renshaw was National Action's spokesman. If you were a intelligence agency creating a honeytrap, the position of spokesman is the one you would most want one of your guys to be in. You'd want one of your own people writing the script and making sure the message is right.

Look, there are people who get off dressing up in costumes and don't need any prodding from the government to do it. Too many.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
National Action's logo
National_Action_UK_logo.jpg

Was based on Oswald Mosely's British Union of Fascists
628410669-mosley-speaks-for-peace-tonight-oswald-mosley-british-union-of-fascists-deployment.jpg


I dunno. I heard a podcast with the leader of National Action and he explained why they did the things they did. He said they were explicitly National Socialist because they didn't want people coming in and then trying to water down the message. So they made the bar very high: National Socialism or gtfo and that was to ward off the thin-skinned.

Also, you think National Action was an MI5 operation but that Renshaw, it's spokesman, wasn't? Renshaw was National Action's spokesman. If you were a intelligence agency creating a honeytrap, the position of spokesman is the one you would most want one of your guys to be in. You'd want one of your own people writing the script and making sure the message is right.

Look, there are people who get off dressing up in costumes and don't need any prodding from the government to do it. Too many.

A picture from Bowie's best ever video.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
"f***ing great point"? You wrote the post that you're replying to, as your IP hash shows. So now you're reduced to replying to your own comments and cheering yourself on to make it seem like there are other anons who are backing you up. A couple of pages ago you wrote four posts in a row while trying to make a couple of those posts seem like they were written by different people.
I know you didn't realise that people with accounts can see the IP hash of anonymous posts, but we can. So we all have been able to marvel at just how desperate and pathetic you are. You really thought you'd get away with it! It's just one humiliation after another with you, isn't it. Back to school, junior!

Hmmm ... in case you are unaware of the phenomena an IP address is not exclusive to an individual but to a location.

So no. No collusion! Just a bunch of ex- Morrissey fans on holiday venting their spleen.

We're allowed to do that, right?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
More claims of collusion and conspiracy. This time about user IPs. Get a grip of yourselves.

These claims come from racists and paedophile sympathisers and are merely attempts to deflect from the accusations made.

This Trumpish attempt to dismiss everything and anything this minority group disapproves of is sinister.

They make racist, white supremacist, holocaust denying and paedophile sympathising comments only to deny their own words. It's infantile and I'll say it again, Trumpish.

If these people genuinely wished to hold a constructive debate then they would have, from the outset, used considerably less inflammatory language about minority and other groups. They didn't. They won't. They can't. Their inherent racism always seeps through. The anger, the hatred is palpable.

The abomination that is Reelfountain has stoked this hatred with utterly unacceptable comments that seek to raise her profile within this forum as an intellectual. She is an imbecile - a comment she throws out wildly to describe others.

It has been said earlier that the onus is on us - the readers - to prove racism and paedophile sympathies. I'd say as a start read Reelfountain's comments in this and the recent For Britain thread. She has kindly provided the proof time and time again only to subsequently 'justify' her comments when challenged - sometimes denying she made the comments at all.

Don't be fooled. There is no collusion. No Fake news. No conspiracy. There is a concerted effort by sensible people to call out racists and paedophile sympathisers.
 

Qvist

Active Member
Oh, come on. It's not as bad as Kill Uncle and don't even get me started on his rockabilly phase.


Very droll. I am fascinated, by the way, to have received a "Troll" rating for having expressed distress at Morrissey's open support of a party which even Nigel Farage has called "Nazi and racist". As if the only possible motive for doing so was malicious trouble-stirring. Discussion on the internet just keeps getting more and more charming.
 

ForgotHowIGotMyName

Well-Known Member
Very droll. I am fascinated, by the way, to have received a "Troll" rating for having expressed distress at Morrissey's open support of a party which even Nigel Farage has called "Nazi and racist".

Your first assumption should be that Morrissey must have heard some very persuasive arguments in order to do that.
 
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