Does being vegetarian mean you are a better Morrissey fan

[2-J]

Something I have stated in previous posts on this subject is my hyporacy. That is an area I have often wondered, especially after highlighting, why it hasn't been picked up. Are you as aware of yours?

No, I'm not aware of it! Please educate me!

I was accusing you of shouting your opinion and running off, rather than being willing to enter into a dialogue. Not just now. Repeatedly in the past as well (on this vegetarianism issue).

Here, yet again, you barged into this thread, threw a few controversial statements about and that was it.

So I don't know what you're accusing me of, but it certainly can't be being the same as you (at least not on this issue).

As I grow older, I have come to realise the pointlessness of trying to bring people round to my way of thinking, and why would I want to?

Why would you want to? Because 'innocent' animals are dying! Wake up. It's up to you to try and help them, right? Aren't meat eaters awful for what they do?

And if not, if eating animals really doesn't matter, f*** off posting your self-righteous defend-the-animals crap here and let us meat-eaters get on with it in peace.

You clearly know better than anyone about everything. I'm glad to have you to educate me.

Hyperbole. I didn't claim to know about 'everything'. I never even said I had the definitive answers on this issue. I was just taking issue with a few things you said. Nice attempt at ad hominen character assassaination to muddy the waters, though.

 

[2-J]

If animal rights don't exist, it would seem human rights don't exist.

Why do you say that? I don't see how that follows at all.

 

[Worm]

I disagree with this. There are a couple of ways to go about saying why I do. The Declaration of Independence mentions inalienable rights granted by a Creator. It doesn't grant these rights to pigeons, but it does say that it's not a human concept. I'm not asking you to say this document is in all ways correct or to walk the plank, but I'm saying that even if you take this concept as an assumption, yours is also an assumption. You can say it's a human concept, but aren't you stacking the deck by asking for empirical evidence?

If animal rights don't exist, it would seem human rights don't exist.

The line reads "all men are created equal". It is not a pedantic reading to suggest that this excludes animals. (Remember also that this was written long before Darwin.)

When I say that rights are a human creation I am not "assuming" anything about nature or natural rights as an empirical truth found in nature, which is why I pointed out that the concept of "natural rights" is ironically named. "Natural rights" simply means that humans do not acquire the rights by citizenship or accomplishment but merely by being born human.

Indeed, the Declaration underscores my argument because it required a document written by a couple of people (based on documents written by others) to establish the ideal of inalienable human rights upon which to found a government. Even this was not enough, though, as it took almost two more centuries to win full rights for all human beings in the United States, including slaves and women.

 

[Morrissey the 23rd]

No, I'm not aware of it! Please educate me!

I was accusing you of shouting your opinion and running off, rather than being willing to enter into a dialogue. Not just now. Repeatedly in the past as well (on this vegetarianism issue).

Here, yet again, you barged into this thread, threw a few controversial statements about and that was it.

So I don't know what you're accusing me of, but it certainly can't be being the same as you (at least not on this issue).



Why would you want to? Because 'innocent' animals are dying! Wake up. It's up to you to try and help them, right? Aren't meat eaters awful for what they do?

And if not, if eating animals really doesn't matter, f*** off posting your self-righteous defend-the-animals crap here and let us meat-eaters get on with it in peace.



Hyperbole. I didn't claim to know about 'everything'. I never even said I had the definitive answers on this issue. I was just taking issue with a few things you said. Nice attempt at ad hominen character assassaination to muddy the waters, though.

"You'll never guess - I'm bored now"

 

[Tbevie]

I’ve been a vegetarian for about three years and if I said that Morrissey didn’t influence my decision in any way then I’d be lying.

It was the lyrics of ‘Meat is Murder’ and hearing Morrissey speak so passionately about animal rights, in interviews that first made me question my own morals. And after doing a lot of research and thinking about it for a few months I decided that I wanted to give up meat.

As for the argument that if people don’t eat meat it will only go to waste, maybe that’s true in some cases but I think it’s very important to have principles and to stand up for what you believe in. And I suppose not eating meat is my, and I’m sure other people’s way of doing that.

I don’t judge meat eaters. How could I, I was one myself for twenty years. I think as we grow older different things become important to us and we become aware of things that we didn't even question before. I’m a very open minded person. And I’d like to think that I would have become vegetarian eventually anyway, even without Morrissey influence.

As for answering the question. First and foremost Morrissey is a singer/songwriter. Buy his records, listen to his music, attend his gigs and I’m sure he’ll be happy enough with that.

 

[Renia]

I’ve been a vegetarian for about three years and if I said that Morrissey didn’t influence my decision in any way then I’d be lying.

It was the lyrics of ‘Meat is Murder’ and hearing Morrissey speak so passionately about animal rights, in interviews that first made me question my own morals. And after doing a lot of research and thinking about it for a few months I decided that I wanted to give up meat.

As for the argument that if people don’t eat meat it will only go to waste, maybe that’s true in some cases but I think it’s very important to have principles and to stand up for what you believe in. And I suppose not eating meat is my, and I’m sure other people’s way of doing that.

I don’t judge meat eaters. How could I, I was one myself for twenty years. I think as we grow older different things become important to us and we become aware of things that we didn't even question before. I’m a very open minded person. And I’d like to think that I would have become vegetarian eventually anyway, even without Morrissey influence.

As for answering the question. First and foremost Morrissey is a singer/songwriter. Buy his records, listen to his music, attend his gigs and I’m sure he’ll be happy enough with that.

I agree with this. He did make me question my own morals of being a meat-eater and it was listening to Meat is Murder for the first time that kinda sealed the deal. I don't try and push my newfound vegatarienism on anyone. I really only mention it when someone either asks about it, or they ask why I'm not eating meat lol. And even then I don't go into any impassioned speech or anything.

Really, I think he just expects us to at least to listen to what he says, and if we don't agree then we don't agree. It's not as if he's going to be going for brunch with us all or anything, (as much as we wish. D

 

[Morrissey the 23rd]

A post for you flesh eaters, lapsed veggies and ahem, the better Morrissey fans, whose flesh free diet was Moz inspired.

Carnivore Chic: From Pasture to Plate, A Search for the Perfect Meat
by Susan Bourette (Proud flesh eater {other than a Morrissey-inspired brief lapse in her adolescence}).

Review in TheStar.com

'Meat, they say, is back.

Was it ever out? Hmm. Well, I do seem to vaguely recall a few hazy days when we anemic teens listened to The Smiths' lead singer Morrissey whine on endlessly about meat being murder. We were committed to a cause. Or, possibly, simply too weak to get up off the floor and change the record.

One by one, most everyone of that smug generation grew up and decided they couldn't live without breakfast sausage. They fell off the veggie wagon.......'

http://www.thestar.com/entertainment/Books/article/407188

 

[EPbabe]

I agree with this. He did make me question my own morals of being a meat-eater and it was listening to Meat is Murder for the first time that kinda sealed the deal. I don't try and push my newfound vegatarienism on anyone. I really only mention it when someone either asks about it, or they ask why I'm not eating meat lol. And even then I don't go into any impassioned speech or anything.

Really, I think he just expects us to at least to listen to what he says, and if we don't agree then we don't agree. It's not as if he's going to be going for brunch with us all or anything, (as much as we wish. D

What about chicken and beef ramen? Is it vegetarian, with artificial chicken and beef flavour in it?

 

[Morrissey the 23rd]

What about chicken and beef ramen? Is it vegetarian, with artificial chicken and beef flavour in it?

If the protein used is flesh or the stock is meat extract then no. If it is made with a protein source such as Quorn and vegetable stock added then, yes it is.

 

[Renia]

What about chicken and beef ramen? Is it vegetarian, with artificial chicken and beef flavour in it?

I read that on the package that it had chicken extract or whatever in it. which is why I don't like eating it, and which was why I was reluctant to eat it the other day, (but it really was the only thing in the house. )

 

[stressford_poet]

Comparing meat-eaters to Nazis doesn't help anyone.
By painting them as 'evil' for something that is completely socially-acceptable, and perhaps even the social norm, makes YOU look like the nutter.

I eat meat. I had a great whopping big burger before I went to see Morrissey. It was tasty. Morrissey was still brilliant.

You're argument is painted in your own hypocracy. Being a nazi in Germany during the third reich was completely socially acceptable, doesn't stop it being evil my friend, and people like Oskar Schindler were seen as nutters, I don't mind being Schindler, I guess that makes you Amon Goeth.

 

[oye terence]

oh noes,not this thread again....

 

[nugz]

You're argument is painted in your own hypocracy. Being a nazi in Germany during the third reich was completely socially acceptable, doesn't stop it being evil my friend, and people like Oskar Schindler were seen as nutters, I don't mind being Schindler, I guess that makes you Amon Goeth.

he was talking about eating meat being socially acceptable. not being a nazi. whyd you have to go and bump this stupid thread anyway?

 

[Mr Smith]

If a quartet of crickets ever records something like "The Queen Is Dead" I'll re-think my position.

I've not read any of these post but saw your last tidbit, and I just wanted to make a throwaway remark. Buddy Holly came close. I've said my bit.

 

[IDon'tOweYouAnything23]

Nope, I don't think it makes someone a 'better' person nor a 'better' Morrissey fan.
I count the Smiths as my favourite band, and I am in awe of Morrisey's solo work, but because I enjoy beef on my roast dinner or a nice bacon sandwich, it doesn't make me less of a person, or some barbaric animal killing fiend either.
Choosing to eat meat is a life choice that I made and that i'm happy with, Morrissey is a God to me, but I don't feel the need to follow all his actions; i.e becoming a vegatarian.

 

[Dante]

Does being Jewish make you a better Woody Allen fan?
No.
I think the same applies here.

Exactly. Oh and it also means you might be anaemic and short of proteins.

Cheers

 

[Hellie]

Exactly. Oh and it also means you might be anaemic and short of proteins.

Cheers

What nonsense.i am the most protein enriched person I know.

 

[Hellie]

oh noes,not this thread again....

Where did you get that curly-haired hunk of a gif from and what has he opened the door to?....could it be Bono without his shades!!!!

 

[stressford_poet]

he was talking about eating meat being socially acceptable. not being a nazi. whyd you have to go and bump this stupid thread anyway?

If you used your brain you'd realise I was making a comparison, in our current society eating meat is socially acceptable, during the third reich in Germany being a nazi was considered by the government to be socially acceptable. What kind of justification is this? But oh well the only ones who suffer are the innocent animals, just as the only ones who suffered during WW2 were the jews... who cares right?

 

[nugz]

If you used your brain you'd realise I was making a comparison, in our current society eating meat is socially acceptable, during the third reich in Germany being a nazi was considered by the government to be socially acceptable. What kind of justification is this? But oh well the only ones who suffer are the innocent animals, just as the only ones who suffered during WW2 were the jews... who cares right?

wow, if you actually had a brain, you wouldnt compare the atrocities of the holocaust to eating a chicken sandwich.