Another trans discussion

[sweetnuthin]

Why would I need to define it, we all know what a real woman really is. Not sure why you don't. It's definitely not a guy playing dress up telling you not to dead name him and you better respect his pronouns. I can tell what is not a woman, Dylan Mulvaney. So again, Boy George can shut his filthy sex offending mouth and leave real women alone to decide what is best for them.

You seem to forget about the existence of trans men, as all TERFs do. All of your transphobic arguments only apply to trans women, so not only are the arguments stupid in the first place, but they are also irrelevant because they only deal with one part of the issue. Not that it's even a big issue - it is blown totally out of proportion by the media on both the left and the right and you seem just to eat it all up rather than re-evaluate your stance. Even if trans people were mentally ill, it'd still be better to want to help them with the proven methods of treating gender dysphoria, rather than just ignore them and continue to fuel the disproportionate suicide rates in the trans community. You forget that these are people too, who are deserving of compassion and human rights, and whose existence does not infringe upon yours. It takes strength to be gentle and kind, and you don't have it. How many times have you actually been at risk from a trans person?

 

[Redacted]

You seem to forget about the existence of trans men, as all TERFs do. All of your transphobic arguments only apply to trans women, so not only are the arguments stupid in the first place, but they are also irrelevant because they only deal with one part of the issue. Not that it's even a big issue - it is blown totally out of proportion by the media on both the left and the right and you seem just to eat it all up rather than re-evaluate your stance. Even if trans people were mentally ill, it'd still be better to want to help them with the proven methods of treating gender dysphoria, rather than just ignore them and continue to fuel the disproportionate suicide rates in the trans community. You forget that these are people too, who are deserving of compassion and human rights, and whose existence does not infringe upon yours. It takes strength to be gentle and kind, and you don't have it. How many times have you actually been at risk from a trans person?

About an hour from where I live, a trans 'woman' has been arrested for making child porn and child molestation. That is the stereotype and stereotypes exist for a reason.
There isn't any existence of 'trans men' to talk about because all of this trans bullshit is just some fantasy of people who are mostly degenerates, like Boy George, a sex offender.
See what they have in common there?

 

[sweetnuthin]

About an hour from where I live, a trans 'woman' has been arrested for making child porn and child molestation. That is the stereotype and stereotypes exist for a reason.
There isn't any existence of 'trans men' to talk about because all of this trans bullshit is just some fantasy of people who are mostly degenerates, like Boy George, a sex offender.
See what they have in common there?

That's one person, who is of course despicable. But you must realise how many respectable and acceptable trans people there are apart from that person who also live within an hour from you, and throughout the world. I know several trans people and they are pretty much the most empathetic and kind people I've ever met. The abuse they face cultivates within them an awareness of the world and of others. We could give contrasting anecdotes and examples forever, but the truth is that you're choosing all the bad examples of trans people and their allies, while I acknowledge that there are both good and bad trans people as there are in any group and in humanity as a whole. And while many of us may not like to admit it, there are always more good people than bad. Evil acts stand out in the media and the mind because they are so uncommon. That you could profess to care about women's rights but not trans rights shows you have missed the point of feminism, which is to deconstruct gender-based stereotypes and social barriers in favour of equality and freedom of expression. All people are affected positively by feminism, as all are affected positively by the trans rights movement. You simply refuse to see that.

 

[Redacted]

That's one person, who is of course despicable. But you must realise how many respectable and acceptable trans people there are apart from that person who also live within an hour from you, and throughout the world. I know several trans people and they are pretty much the most empathetic and kind people I've ever met. The abuse they face cultivates within them an awareness of the world and of others. We could give contrasting anecdotes and examples forever, but the truth is that you're choosing all the bad examples of trans people and their allies, while I acknowledge that there are both good and bad trans people as there are in any group and in humanity as a whole. And while many of us may not like to admit it, there are always more good people than bad. Evil acts stand out in the media and the mind because they are so uncommon. That you could profess to care about women's rights but not trans rights shows you have missed the point of feminism, which is to deconstruct gender-based stereotypes and social barriers in favour of equality and freedom of expression. All people are affected positively by feminism, as all are affected positively by the trans rights movement. You simply refuse to see that.

LOL Feminists do not suppport these men parading around as women. I am done with this.

 

[sweetnuthin]

LOL Feminists do not suppport these men parading around as women. I am done with this.

Once again you missed the point, so I too am done. Mild best wishes.

 

[bhops]

I really struggle to understand the modern day obsession with the whole 'trans' thing.
Five years ago it was hardly mentioned at all.
The one positive aspect for me is that I now know what a pronoun is.

Listen women can have penises OK, and if you deny it then you're just denying reality

 

[bhops]

Agreed. Trans people have existed in society for aaaages. Trans women have been using female bathrooms for decades, and no one batted an eyelid. A trans woman won the UK version of Big Brother when it was still mega popular, and people loved her - no one batted an eyelid. A trans woman was a major character on Coronation Street, and everyone loved her - no one batted an eyelid. Trans rights were cemented in the Equality Act 2010, and no one batted an eyelid.

I suspect that trans rights have come to fore because it's just another culture war issue (along with other "issues" like refugees, immigration etc.) being touted by powerful, vested interests to distract people from actual issues like the rich robbing us all the time, or the cost of living crisis or perpetual war.

Trans people are just another ball being kicked around by the elites to distract the gullible people from real actual issues. Unfortunately, distracting people with what essentially amounts to lies and propaganda works, in democracies and dictatorships. Trans people weren't the first metaphorical ball to be kicked around, and they won't be the last.

5 years ago trans women weren't demanding that you accept them as real women. They weren't demanding the right to compete in women's sports etc etc. As usual the slope is slippery.

 

[Luxo]

Once again you missed the point, so I too am done. Mild best wishes.

About an hour from where I live, a trans 'woman' has been arrested for making child porn and child molestation. That is the stereotype and stereotypes exist for a reason.
There isn't any existence of 'trans men' to talk about because all of this trans bullshit is just some fantasy of people who are mostly degenerates, like Boy George, a sex offender.
See what they have in common there?

Cis men and women both commit horrendous sexual offences, the overwhelming majority of them carried out by cis men. Where's your hatred for them, or your desire to see them have their rights removed? Oh, you won't do that will you.

Trans people are more like to be the victims of violent and sexual crimes than commit crimes:

Transgender people over four times more likely than cisgender people to be victims of violent crime

williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu

Again, women are generally supportive of trans rights:

New poll, same finding: women more supportive of trans rights than men

There's an odd and unhelpful difference between what gets said about trans rights and what the public actually thinks.

www.markpack.org.uk

Majority of women support self-identification for transgender people, poll finds

YouGov finds support strong for trans rights despite media backlash against Gender Recognition Act reforms

www.independent.co.uk

One here specifically for "feminists" - https://www.washingtonpost.com/made-by-history/2023/07/27/trans-rights-feminism-conservative-women/ (original data is here - https://www.prri.org/spotlight/identity-politics-and-transgender-equality/)

I could find more data, but you're the one who made the false statement, so the burden of proof is on you. Happy to help you learn some very, very, very basic research skills though.

If anything, your views are more in line with Christian nationalists and in line with misogynistic men, which makes sense considering the homophobia you have been happy to display here when talking about Boy George. No, he wasn't found guilty of a sexual offence, you knew that anyway, but you're so blinded by your own right-wing, Christian Nationalist hatred that you make false accusations. If you were in the UK, Boy George would have a strong case for suing you for libel for making false and very damaging statements.

 

[Luxo]

5 years ago trans women weren't demanding that you accept them as real women. They weren't demanding the right to compete in women's sports etc etc. As usual the slope is slippery.

Trans women have competed in cis women's sports since the 1970s. Again, it's only just come to your attention because you've been convinced it's an issue by a right-wing press and right-wing politicians who use trans people to distract from the world metaphorically and literally being on fire.

 

[Luxo]

Listen women can have penises OK, and if you deny it then you're just denying reality

Yeah, again, lots of women (who are not transgender) are born with penises. It's called intersex.

These are not new concepts or discoveries.

 

[Redacted]

Cis men and women both commit horrendous sexual offences, the overwhelming majority of them carried out by cis men.

Yes, the crime I spoke of was carried out by a cis man posing as a woman, also known as a trans also known as pedos and rapists. Thanks for proving my point. I'm done.

 

[Luxo]

Yes, the crime I spoke of was carried out by a cis man posing as a woman, also known as a trans also known as pedos and rapists. Thanks for proving my point. I'm done.

I know you're not the sharpest knife, but your point isn't proven in any way shape or form, Redacted, especially with an anecdotal story and especially with you ignoring the crime statistics.

 

[gashonthenail]

Yeah, again, lots of women (who are not transgender) are born with penises. It's called intersex.

These are not new concepts or discoveries.

Intersex is a totally different subject and nothing to do with the ideological belief that sex is determined by how you feel inside.
Some women can be born with ambiguous genitalia, e.g. an enlarged clitoris that looks like a small penis, or labia that are fused and look like a scrotum. None of that means that there are lots of women born with a penis as you suggest. Intersex is just further demonstration of the fact that sex is binary and that we are a sexually dimorphic species. And none of this relates to evidence that there is such a thing as 'gender identity'.

Ambiguous genitalia: MedlinePlus Medical Encyclopedia

Ambiguous genitalia is a rare condition where a child is born with outer genitals that do not clearly look either male or female. They may have features of both sexes or not be fully developed. The characteristics

medlineplus.gov

 

[Luxo]

Intersex is a totally different subject and nothing to do with the ideological belief that sex is determined by how you feel inside.
Some women can be born with ambiguous genitalia, e.g. an enlarged clitoris that looks like a small penis, or labia that are fused and look like a scrotum. None of that means that there are lots of women born with a penis as you suggest. Intersex is just further demonstration of the fact that sex is binary and that we are a sexually dimorphic species. And none of this relates to evidence that there is such a thing as 'gender identity'.

Ambiguous genitalia: MedlinePlus Medical Encyclopedia

Ambiguous genitalia is a rare condition where a child is born with outer genitals that do not clearly look either male or female. They may have features of both sexes or not be fully developed. The characteristics

medlineplus.gov

Sex clearly isn't binary if someone can be born with both male and female reproductive organs and identify as either a man or woman. If sex was binary, intersex people wouldn't exist. The science is pretty clear on this.

Biological Science Rejects the Sex Binary, and That’s Good for Humanity

Science reveals diverse ways of being male, female, or both. An anthropologist argues that embracing this truth will help humans flourish.

www.sapiens.org

Here's Why Human Sex Is Not Binary

Ova don’t make a woman, and sperm don’t make a man

www.scientificamerican.com

The Inclusion of Sex and Gender Beyond the Binary in Toxicology

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Sex redefined - Nature

The idea of two sexes is simplistic. Biologists now think there is a wider spectrum than that.

www.nature.com

Jesus wept, what does it take to speak to someone who is semi-intelligent on this forum.

 

[bhops]

Yeah, again, lots of women (who are not transgender) are born with penises. It's called intersex.

These are not new concepts or discoveries.

Intersex is literally a minute portion of the population and a genetic abnormality. There are people with 3 nipples as well but we would tend to say that humans have 2 nipples.

 

[bhops]

Intersex is a totally different subject and nothing to do with the ideological belief that sex is determined by how you feel inside.
Some women can be born with ambiguous genitalia, e.g. an enlarged clitoris that looks like a small penis, or labia that are fused and look like a scrotum. None of that means that there are lots of women born with a penis as you suggest. Intersex is just further demonstration of the fact that sex is binary and that we are a sexually dimorphic species. And none of this relates to evidence that there is such a thing as 'gender identity'.

Ambiguous genitalia: MedlinePlus Medical Encyclopedia

Ambiguous genitalia is a rare condition where a child is born with outer genitals that do not clearly look either male or female. They may have features of both sexes or not be fully developed. The characteristics

medlineplus.gov

Correct, but they always pivot to the intersex example as the reason Boris with his 5 o'clock shadow should now be allowed to hang out in the women's' bathrooms fondling his nuts and wondering when to book in for his prostrate exam.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

Intersex is literally a minute portion of the population and a genetic abnormality. There are people with 3 nipples as well but we would tend to say that humans have 2 nipples.

haha i love how luxo says "lots of women", as though it's common and aint no thang, when actually intersex is an extremely rare condition (having an auxiliary nipple IS common compared to being intersex).

 

[gashonthenail]

Sex clearly isn't binary if someone can be born with both male and female reproductive organs and identify as either a man or woman. If sex was binary, intersex people wouldn't exist. The science is pretty clear on this.

Biological Science Rejects the Sex Binary, and That’s Good for Humanity

Science reveals diverse ways of being male, female, or both. An anthropologist argues that embracing this truth will help humans flourish.

www.sapiens.org

Here's Why Human Sex Is Not Binary

Ova don’t make a woman, and sperm don’t make a man

www.scientificamerican.com

The Inclusion of Sex and Gender Beyond the Binary in Toxicology

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Sex redefined - Nature

The idea of two sexes is simplistic. Biologists now think there is a wider spectrum than that.

www.nature.com

Jesus wept, what does it take to speak to someone who is semi-intelligent on this forum.

Again, intersex is a different topic all together. Intersex people are still either male or female, those born with chromosomal abnormalities are incredibly rare, and the vast majority view themselves as either male or female according to their biological sex - indeed, the historical term for intersex, hermaphroditism, is not used these days for exactly that reason, that the vast majority of people with these conditions just want to be viewed and treated as male or female, according to their biological sex.
You have posted links to some opinion pieces arguing that sex is a spectrum, and previously to studies of outcomes of treatment for trans people - it is just as easy I can assure you to post links to prestigious scientists arguing the opposite, and to evidence that outcomes of treatment for trans people are not good. Even The Guardian, when reporting one of the studies you quoted, felt obliged to point out that the study had a huge drop-out rate that could potentially compromise the study's validity. Happier patients tend to stick with a study much more than unhappy ones.
As someone who claims to be on the left, I find it bizarre that you can't see that trans treatments are being pushed on confused kids so that big medical corporations can make big profits - and that pushing these treatments on kids is child abuse. But clearly lefties supporting big profits for big corporations is all just part of the crazy upside down world we live in these days...

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/bies.202200173#:~:text=BIOLOGICAL%20SEX%20AS%20A%20BINARY%20VARIABLE,-Biological%20sex%20is&text=With%20a%20few%20exceptions%2C%20all,usually%20motile%20gametes%20(sperm).

Transition as Treatment: The Best Studies Show the Worst Outcomes

A pattern begins to emerge as we survey some of the best and longest outcome studies on gender transition: the longer the studies and the better the methods, the more negative the results.

www.thepublicdiscourse.com

 

[bhops]

haha i love how luxo says "lots of women", as though it's common and aint no thang, when actually intersex is an extremely rare condition (having an auxiliary nipple IS common compared to being intersex).

Yeah but Luxo would have us believe that there is no difference between intersex and these types of beauties.

The f***en state of it

 

[nicky wire's legs]

Yeah but Luxo would have us believe that there is no difference between intersex and these types of beauties.

The f***en state of it

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View attachment 94750

what a pair of oafs. imagine being a man and cheating women out of something they've worked for for their entire lives and actually feeling proud of yourself for it