Years of Refusal is utterly brilliant

[justme]

This is a strange request on an open discussion board. Why would you single out the people who aren't happy with the record and tell them that they should be quiet? What about the people who keep saying over and over and over again that it's a masterpiece? Would you like them to open up a thread to discuss their least favorite albums, since they are just saying the same thing over and over and over again too? Isn't the point here to discuss our opinions about Morrissey, the good and the bad?

I never said anyone should be quiet and the answer to your question is yes, and the KEY WORD is discuss. As I said, I enjoyed discussing earlier with vauxhall and in fact that's what I expect from a fan board - but not posters to repeat repeat over and over again just that it's crap everytime someone seems to enjoy the album.

 

[Your Arsenal]

Two words! The Smiths! Nuff said!

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow, thanks for that

 

[Orson Swells]

To me, it sounds like all these effects were added to compensate for the lack of substance.

I think you're getting confused with Kill Uncle. (See The Harsh Truth of the Camera Eye) I do find it funny when I read Morrissey fans saying, as they seem to, that he isn't as good as he used to be...

I remember when The Queen Is Dead came out and fans complained that it contained two already released singles (one over six months old!)

I remember when The World Won't Listen came out and fans complained that they had most of the songs already and three were from The Queen Is Dead.

I remember when Louder Than Bombs came out and fans just complained.

I remember when Strangeways, Here We Come came out and fans complained it wasn't as good as The Queen Is Dead

I remember when Viva Hate came out and fans complained that it wasn't as good as The Smiths.

I remember when Bona Drag came out and fans complained that they had all the songs already.

I remember when Kill Out came out and fans complained that it was too short and lightweight.

I remember when Your Arsenal came out and fans complained that it was too loud and glam rock-orientated.

I remember when Vauxhall and I came out and fans complained that it was too commercial and mainstream.

I remember when Southpaw Grammar came out and fans complained it was too loud and rock-orientated.

I remember when Maladjusted cam out and fans complained it was too bland and musically uninspiring.

I remember when You Are The Quarry came out and fans complained it was too mainstream and Morrissey had sold out.

I remember when Ringleader of the Tormentors came out and fans complained it wasn't as good as You Are The Quarry.

And now, Years of Refusal is (almost) out and - well, you know the rest...

Morrissey fans like to complain! Why can't they just take each release on its individual merits and enjoy it for what it is!?

I think without doubt Years of Refusal will be seen as one of his very best solo albums. Energetic, dynamic, direct. It's not Viva Hate. It's not Kill Uncle. It's not Vauxhall and I. It's Morrissey now. Enjoy him while you can!

 

[Theo]

Morrissey himself has said something along the lines of, if he doesn't love every single track of someone's album he feels it's a failure.

I like Years of Refusal quite a bit, but it's definitely missing something. It needs one or two more songs that completely blow you away, instead of just so many merely good Morrissey songs. "Its Not Your Birthday Anymore" is definitely a masterpiece song, but there should be at least one more of those on the album! If not two more!

Then we'd be talking about one hell of a killer album instead of just talking about a good album.


But a good album is pretty cool, too.

 

[Maurice E]

I think you're getting confused with Kill Uncle. (See The Harsh Truth of the Camera Eye) I do find it funny when I read Morrissey fans saying, as they seem to, that he isn't as good as he used to be...

I remember when The Queen Is Dead came out and fans complained that it contained two already released singles (one over six months old!)

I remember when The World Won't Listen came out and fans complained that they had most of the songs already and three were from The Queen Is Dead.

I remember when Louder Than Bombs came out and fans just complained.

I remember when Strangeways, Here We Come came out and fans complained it wasn't as good as The Queen Is Dead

I remember when Viva Hate came out and fans complained that it wasn't as good as The Smiths.

I remember when Bona Drag came out and fans complained that they had all the songs already.

I remember when Kill Out came out and fans complained that it was too short and lightweight.

I remember when Your Arsenal came out and fans complained that it was too loud and glam rock-orientated.

I remember when Vauxhall and I came out and fans complained that it was too commercial and mainstream.

I remember when Southpaw Grammar came out and fans complained it was too loud and rock-orientated.

I remember when Maladjusted cam out and fans complained it was too bland and musically uninspiring.

I remember when You Are The Quarry came out and fans complained it was too mainstream and Morrissey had sold out.

I remember when Ringleader of the Tormentors came out and fans complained it wasn't as good as You Are The Quarry.

And now, Years of Refusal is (almost) out and - well, you know the rest...

Morrissey fans like to complain! Why can't they just take each release on its individual merits and enjoy it for what it is!?

I think without doubt Years of Refusal will be seen as one of his very best solo albums. Energetic, dynamic, direct. It's not Viva Hate. It's not Kill Uncle. It's not Vauxhall and I. It's Morrissey now. Enjoy him while you can!

great posting Orson. excellent perspective.
even if YOR isn't consistently great, it's an intriguing year to be a Moz fan. we have a cameo from a 1960s guitar legend, a duet with the wonderful Chrissie Hynde, tons of new Morrissey/Whyte b-sides to look forward to, loads of concerts (here in the UK at least) for which tickets are easily available (at face value); we really need to realise how lucky we are...

 

[StillillGal]

i loved that album from first hear!
some great songs!!!

 

[Theo]

And let me tell you something. If there's a masterpiece song hidden away amongst the b-sides for these singles (like "Nobody Loves Us" was for "Southpaw Grammar"), I'm gonna track Morrissey down and have words with him.

 

[Comtesse]

I remember when The Queen Is Dead came out and fans complained that it contained two already released singles (one over six months old!)

Ha! I was annoyed by that too! But I mostly complained about "Vicar In A Tutu" and "Some Girls Are Bigger Than Others". It took me a long time to get into "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out" because I avoided that second side out of extreme annoyance at the stupid "joke" songs and old singles.

Good post - us old folks can look back fondly on the controversies that surrounded each album's release, though I don't remember anyone not liking Your Arsenal or Vauxhall and I upon their release. I think those two albums were the exceptions to the rule. As I listen to Morrissey and The Smiths on shuffle, it impresses me how rare it is to have had an artist in my life since I was 17 years old, and to be still listening to him and enjoying talking about him and weighing the merits, and lack thereof, of his new songs at the age of 42. Truly, I'm gonna miss him when he's gone - but what a back catalogue!

And I'm reminded of a quote by The Man himself: "Complaining is so unmanly... which is why I do it so well!!"

 

[matt]

great posting Orson. excellent perspective.
even if YOR isn't consistently great, it's an intriguing year to be a Moz fan. we have a cameo from a 1960s guitar legend, a duet with the wonderful Chrissie Hynde, tons of new Morrissey/Whyte b-sides to look forward to, loads of concerts (here in the UK at least) for which tickets are easily available (at face value); we really need to realise how lucky we are...

The tickets were hardly 'easily' available, thanks largely to touts. I certainly dont have tickets and am at a loss as to whether I want to spend a fortune on eBay AGAIN.

And am I the only one here who doesnt really rate Your Arsenal? I love some tracks but the stupid ones like 'fatty' just spoil the flow of the album.

Matt

 

[Comtesse]

And am I the only one here who doesnt really rate Your Arsenal? I love some tracks but the stupid ones like 'fatty' just spoil the flow of the album.

I've always felt that way too. "Fatty" and "We Hate It..." muck up the album terribly - I always listen to it with those songs removed. However, everyone I knew at the time was ga-ga over it thanks to how terrible Kill Uncle was. I think a lot of times albums are overrated initially in response to the album that came previously: Your Arsenal was overrated because Kill Uncle was horrible and Maladjusted was overrated because Southpaw was horrible. I think maybe the same thing is going on with Years Of Refusal, since so many people despised Ringleader.

 

[Anaesthesine]

And let me tell you something. If there's a masterpiece song hidden away amongst the b-sides for these singles (like "Nobody Loves Us" was for "Southpaw Grammar"), I'm gonna track Morrissey down and have words with him.

Amen Wilbur, I'll join you. I still can't get over "My Dearest Love," and I have a feeling that the new Morrissey/Chrissie Hynde duet (isn't it another vinyl b-side only?) is going to be utterly fantastic.

As I listen to Morrissey and The Smiths on shuffle, it impresses me how rare it is to have had an artist in my life since I was 17 years old, and to be still listening to him and enjoying talking about him and weighing the merits, and lack thereof, of his new songs at the age of 42. Truly, I'm gonna miss him when he's gone - but what a back catalogue!

Ha, we're about the same age. I remember listening to The Smiths when it came out - first year of college. I will honestly say that I did not fall in love with Morrissey then, but he crawled under my skin, and it's been touch-and-go ever since.

We were all musicians when that first album came out (I fronted my own band), and we were hyper-critical and snotty, and we were all amazed at how singular The Smiths were - no one I know had a negative thing to say about that album. People really got riled with Meat is Murder.

Now here I am, all these years later, a wee bit obsessed about someone who I would never, in a million years, have thought would get to me this way. The only other singer who I've loved/listened to for longer is Marc Almond, and he's actually put out more music that I have found unlistenable (although I still adore him, and always will).

Morrissey, despite (or maybe due to) all his flaws, has managed to maintain a remarkable level of uniqueness that I think serves him well in middle-age. Bless his contrary little heart.

 

[Comtesse]

We were all musicians when that first album came out (I fronted my own band), and we were hyper-critical and snotty, and we were all amazed at how singular The Smiths were - no one I know had a negative thing to say about that album. People really got riled with Meat is Murder.

I remember hating Meat Is Murder the first time I listened to it. I thought the production was AWFUL. I remember calling my friend Ann and whining to her about it: "Why did they decide to produce it themselves? It's utter rubbish!!!" I also thought side 2 was really poor: I hated "Meat Is Murder" and "Barbarism Begins At Home" and it took me awhile to get into "Well I Wonder". "Nowhere Fast" was just okay. And I was annoyed that they included "How Soon Is Now?" on the American version since I already had it as the b-side of "William, It Was Really Nothing" AND on Hatful Of Hollow and I never really liked it that much to begin with. Oh, such torment!!!!

The funny thing is that by the time The Queen Is Dead was released, I was unhappy with the majority of that album because of the "comical" lyrics of most of the songs. I wanted serious, sad lyrics like on Meat Is Murder!

Hmmmm, come to think of it, maybe my first impressions aren't to be trusted...

 

[vicarinatutugal]

I think you're getting confused with Kill Uncle. (See The Harsh Truth of the Camera Eye) I do find it funny when I read Morrissey fans saying, as they seem to, that he isn't as good as he used to be...

I remember when The Queen Is Dead came out and fans complained that it contained two already released singles (one over six months old!)

I remember when The World Won't Listen came out and fans complained that they had most of the songs already and three were from The Queen Is Dead.

I remember when Louder Than Bombs came out and fans just complained.

I remember when Strangeways, Here We Come came out and fans complained it wasn't as good as The Queen Is Dead

I remember when Viva Hate came out and fans complained that it wasn't as good as The Smiths.

I remember when Bona Drag came out and fans complained that they had all the songs already.

I remember when Kill Out came out and fans complained that it was too short and lightweight.

I remember when Your Arsenal came out and fans complained that it was too loud and glam rock-orientated.

I remember when Vauxhall and I came out and fans complained that it was too commercial and mainstream.

I remember when Southpaw Grammar came out and fans complained it was too loud and rock-orientated.

I remember when Maladjusted cam out and fans complained it was too bland and musically uninspiring.

I remember when You Are The Quarry came out and fans complained it was too mainstream and Morrissey had sold out.

I remember when Ringleader of the Tormentors came out and fans complained it wasn't as good as You Are The Quarry.

And now, Years of Refusal is (almost) out and - well, you know the rest...

Morrissey fans like to complain! Why can't they just take each release on its individual merits and enjoy it for what it is!?

I think without doubt Years of Refusal will be seen as one of his very best solo albums. Energetic, dynamic, direct. It's not Viva Hate. It's not Kill Uncle. It's not Vauxhall and I. It's Morrissey now. Enjoy him while you can!

 

[vicarinatutugal]

This is a strange request on an open discussion board. Why would you single out the people who aren't happy with the record and tell them that they should be quiet? What about the people who keep saying over and over and over again that it's a masterpiece? Would you like them to open up a thread to discuss their least favorite albums, since they are just saying the same thing over and over and over again too? Isn't the point here to discuss our opinions about Morrissey, the good and the bad?

another comment that deserves applause. Totally wholehearedly agree.

 

[One of your children]

i now firmly think that if morrissey wants to put another crappy album like this one again he should retire. I forgave ROTT for pigsty...but enough is enough

u the man!

 

[Velvis]

Hmmmm, come to think of it, maybe my first impressions aren't to be trusted...

It's not just your first impressions that can't be trusted Comtesse, it's everybody's.
Smiths/Moz albums have a habit of maturing with age - and getting better.
Which is why I find it slightly irritating when people listen to the new releases and immediately dismiss them as rubbish.

Let's assess YOR in 12 months

 

[Velvis]

i now firmly think that if morrissey wants to put another crappy album like this one again he should retire. I forgave ROTT for pigsty...but enough is enough

...sigh

 

[vicarinatutugal]

i now firmly think that if morrissey wants to put another crappy album like this one again he should retire. I forgave ROTT for pigsty...but enough is enough

I find these threads annoying and interesting in equal measures. It is interesting to see how everyone differs in taste so much, I love ringleader there is lots of good songs on there as far as I feel.

 

[One of your children]

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow, thanks for that

U are more than welcome my friend!

 

[Comtesse]

It's not just your first impressions that can't be trusted Comtesse, it's everybody's.
Smiths/Moz albums have a habit of maturing with age - and getting better.
Which is why I find it slightly irritating when people listen to the new releases and immediately dismiss them as rubbish.

Let's assess YOR in 12 months

Yes, it works both ways too. Some of the people who are calling Years Of Refusal a brilliant album may think it's just okay in 12 months. I know I had a much higher opinion of Ringleader after the first week of listening to it than I did after the first month. Time will tell...