The Smiths VS U2

Bono's lyrics are often intentionally abstract, Old Testament-meets-rock 'n' roll fare. In that way they complement The Edge's playing, which was always pretty abstract, at least until their latest, post-"Pop" phase. U2 at their best are more of a total package-- every element meshing perfectly with the others-- rather than a band you can break apart, piece by piece, and analyze.

Look no further than Adam Clayton, who is the Justin Timberlake of bassists. Yet there aren't many U2 basslines I would change. They work in context.

Bono writes almost from free-association, letting words "just come to him". (Another, underpublicized aspect of his prophetic/messianic persona.) If you've ever heard the song "Elvis Presley And America", apparently that's the sound of a half-finished song, with Bono still working out the lyrics as he goes along. When you think about how Morrissey works, with the words in his head, needing only a few takes to sing the vocals, the two songwriters become even more markedly different.

Over the last decade or so, Bono has become more of a "proper" songwriter, and the band has become more "professional". The result is often blandness*. But back in the good old days, when God was feeding Bono his lyrics, there were some pretty amazing tunes-- "Bad" comes to mind as a sublime song that dissolves into nonsense upon analysis of the words. Nowadays Bono and U2 write more conventionally, and the results are middling. And God, well, God's left Bono to his charities. Instead He's been whispering advice into George W. Bush's ears.



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* Sadly, New Order have followed the same trajectory.
 
Erik said:
first off - The Smiths - are the greatest of all time - by a country mile.

Now, I was thinking that other groups out there may not be as good as The Smiths were, but they do have great songs from time to time. How would you all judge the following songs battles?

U2
Sunday Bloody Sunday vs The Queen Is Dead
Pride (In The Name Of Love) vs Shoplifters Of The World Unite
With Or Without You vs Well I Wonder
I Still Haven't Found.... vs Bigmouth Strikes Again
Where The Streets Have No Name vs Headmaster Ritual
One vs There Is A Light That Never Goes Out

I seem to be one of the few who loves both bands.

I would rate the war like this:
SBS by an inch (Queen is Dead is a little too rambling IMO)
Shoplifters beats any live version of Pride but the studio version is almost a draw with Shoplifters barely winning due to pacing, drums, and some interesting lyric and lyric delivery
With or Without You wins by a mile (although Well I Wonder is gorgeous)
Bigmouth easy although ISHFWILF studio vocals are stunning (to say the least) if you listen closely
Streets although Bono cannot sing it worth a shit anymore... obviously
There is a Light (they have strangled One)...the sheer majesty and vocal (complete with bipolar uplifting sounding chorus coupled with a beautiful picture of disaster) of which overshines One effortlessly
 
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I also should say (flame away) that the Smiths cannot be the greatest band ever due to their often (in the earlier days) shambolic and sort of sloppy live playing.

This one factor makes it impossible for me to give them the title.

U2 has always been a better live band overall but Bono very rarely the better performer.

Bono has usually been more of a "belter" which communicates better (often) on a larger scale. He has also hit some sublime notes in his career - no doubt about it. The entire song Lemon comes to mind.

Lyrically...while in the Smiths Moz was a better lyricist..... now Bono is probably slighly better... with Moz gettings points for unique topics...although most of the lyric on HTDAAB stink so hard to say really.... Even with all of Moz's changes during his solo years Bono has still more successfully changed "styles"....

Lyrically is is hard to say but overall I guess Moz wins in this area... with Bono having some very outstanding moments such as A Sort of Homecoming, Lemon, Stay....
 
I have trouble believing U2 are as big as they are. Everyone seems to hate them! I literally do not know a single person that doesn't actively dislike U2, besides my brother and myself.

All That You Can't Leave Behind had some shameless U2-by-numbers singles, but once you get past that you're left with (imo) some of the best songs U2's ever done. Kite, Wild Honey, and Walk On are all U2 classics as far as I'm concerned.
 
++++++ said:
I have trouble believing U2 are as big as they are. Everyone seems to hate them! I literally do not know a single person that doesn't actively dislike U2, besides my brother and myself.

All That You Can't Leave Behind had some shameless U2-by-numbers singles, but once you get past that you're left with (imo) some of the best songs U2's ever done. Kite, Wild Honey, and Walk On are all U2 classics as far as I'm concerned.

Kite is great vocally but the lines with "hip-hop drove the big cars" sounds too forced and trite. Otherwise a great song.

Walk On is great but a little too cheesy.

Wild Honey is pop guilty pleasure and really is a pretty good tune.

Beautiful Day is under-rated (spelling?) IMO even with the airplay it had.

New York is a gem.

I could go on....
 
"...lights go out on red hill..." :) Damn I love that song. Great vocal track. Have you heard Dream Theater's live cover of that? It's outstanding! Dear Lord, did I dare mention the name of a progressive metal band in a Morrissey forum? :eek:
 
Redhill said:
I also should say (flame away) that the Smiths cannot be the greatest band ever due to their often (in the earlier days) shambolic and sort of sloppy live playing.

What? Shambolic and sloppy? I have no idea where you're coming from on this point. No disrespect to your opinion about U2, but The Smiths were an amazingly tight unit onstage, both in the early and the last days (captured on "Rank"). Crazy to suggest otherwise.

Objectively, I might admit U2 are a better live band-- just looking at factors besides the quality of the songs-- but not by much. I've seen them a few times and they're great, especially in large places, but in any event no way were The Smiths sloppy.
 
Worm said:
What? Shambolic and sloppy? I have no idea where you're coming from on this point. No disrespect to your opinion about U2, but The Smiths were an amazingly tight unit onstage, both in the early and the last days (captured on "Rank"). Crazy to suggest otherwise.

Objectively, I might admit U2 are a better live band-- just looking at factors besides the quality of the songs-- but not by much. I've seen them a few times and they're great, especially in large places, but in any event no way were The Smiths sloppy.

In terms of musical ability and quality of live performance, it's very difficult and perhaps a bit unfair to compare the two bands. U2 have almost 30 years of experience playing together onstage while The Smiths only had...what, 6 years? So of course U2 have no reason to be a mediocre live act. Trying to be as objective as possible, In the first six years of either band's professional career (1980 - 1986), I'd wager that The Smiths were the more accomplished and refined group of musicans while U2 were the more experienced (or exhaustive) touring act. U2 were tireless in their touring schedules. The 1984/1985 Unforgettable Fire Tour alone saw the band doing four different legs, crisscrossing the globe on numerous occassions. The Smiths touring calendar was sparse in comparison, but as a live unit they were anything but sloppy, as evidenced by many live bootlegs.
 
U2 can be awesome live
this knowledge can make one like them in spite of their negatives
also, Bono annoys some of us as time goes by, as a non-music personality
but as a band it would be nice to not know that
regarding u2 vis a vis the smiths it is a question of U2 not breaking up and in many people's eyes not being as good as the years went on
while the Smiths did break up, so who knows, I for one know I prefer to think of the Smiths as being superior to U2 in every way had they had the same longevity, but this seems appropriate to the Smiths regardless
what could have been fits the Smiths pathos
so apples and oranges
& regarding those song comparisons
some weird to me but whatever;
Sunday Bloody Sunday is one of those 'great polarizing' songs of the early 80's as opposed to the queen is dead which is sarcastic to such a degree as to baffle my British mother, while Sunday... elicited a warning to not play that when granpa was around lest he think i was a 'bloody papist'
:D
Shoplifters Of The World Unite hearing this song before studying marxism is very very funny and informative, as opposed to
Pride which is just u2 plumbing history again for emotion and doing a good job of it, but note here; I know for a fact that many African-Americans get annoyed when white people play it, or worse inadvertently quote it when mentioning MLK

Bigmouth Strikes Again is the best smiths dance song maybe, while I Still Haven't Found.... has that guitar riff that is all most remember

Headmaster Ritual is umm, like wow, one of those totally awesome Smiths anthems, to such a point that more than once i have used saying the 1st couple words of it and seeing if the other person could say the next couple lines as a 'check' of other people's 'Smiths cred'
on the other hand, Where The Streets Have No Name is great as a cover by the Petshop Boys

finally, There Is A Light That Never Goes Out is a song that i have witnessed to many women swoon over still when Moz sings it, but also I know of more than a few that specifically stated a desire to be 'happy to hear it' were it the only Smiths song they heard him do live
and while One is good, it requires u2, not just Bono
also, arguably a greater level of love for the sentimental on any that 'really get into it' it has bad karaoke written all over it, rather than being like 'There is a light' which should be fairly easy to see to most to leave to the professionals...
 
I'm a fan of both groups, I listen to the Smiths more than U2. The Smiths songs are more personal to me but I think U2 is a great live band but their latest cd's have been disappointing. The best thing about U2 is Larry.
 
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JoyDiv007 said:
I'm a fan of both groups, I listen to the Smiths more than U2. The Smiths songs are more personal to me but I think U2 is a great live band but their latest cd's have been disappointing. The best thing about U2 is Larry.

Larry is severly under-rated.

I am shocked that there has not been more (emphatic) U2 bashing?!

Oh...and yes... Red Hill Mining Town... has spectacular vocals.

;-]
 
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