Scott Rodger (Maverick) leaks Morrissey information and email re: Bonfire / Miley via X (October 17, 2023)

There's been drama!

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Related item:

• Scott Rodger (Maverick/Quest): Bonfire of Teenagers scheduled for Feb. 23, delayed by featured artist - Dec 24, 2022

 

[Famous when dead]

I ask you again: Why has Capitol never announced the record deal with Morrissey? Not even long before the MC fiasco?
And why has Capitol never responded to Morrissey's allegations?
Then the release of Rebels. Nothing from Capitol again!
This is all very strange, don't you think?

If the 'facts' are to be believed, then it was a 'licencing agreement' as opposed to a traditional 'record deal'.
Licencing agreements involve a financial advance upfront. The artist hands over or then records / produces an album (and usually pays for) the recording (normally with full creative control) and the company involved gets to recoup the advance by distributing and selling the music via products. Their main risk besides money is if the music doesn't sell well.
That may go some way to explain Rebels... appearing via a 'licence' mentioning Capitol & UMG.
That said, it's all become so convoluted and confusing, it's probably not worth trying to decipher.
Regards,
FWD.

 

[SuedeMoz]

What *is( clear from the email. Columbia said "no" at least twice. Morrissey knew this. He went ahead and promoted Miley's involvement anyway, did not seem to care about Columbia's denial, did want to promote Miley's involvement for commercial, culture war (and I suppose) artistic reasons, and deeply cared/cares about Miley's own feelings about her inclusion/promotion/ And then he blamed Capitol for withholding the album, while disclosing *none* of those particulars

Hard to say if he genuinely cared about Miley's feelings or if he (naively) saw it as a way to go around the record companies. But claiming to be a victim of a censorship conspiracy... when he knew the truth is pretty hard to stomach. They say that some people who lie profusely actually start to believe their lies - is that the case here?

 

[Anonymous]

It could easily have been Moz/Miley/Jessie and the players doing the session - "damn the suits, we're the *artists* s than Michelle or anyone at Capitol. We certainly don't know enough to say who decided to go ahead with the session. Capitol could have said "You're doing this at your own risk/volition. We were already told no. Miley will have to be uncredited/nonpromoted"- and again the artist camp could have decided to go full torpedoes ahead, anyway

Blaming Capitol Or Moz definitively for going ahead with the session, based on the information available would be unfair as we don't have enough info to say one way or the other. Both are equally plausible

What *is( clear from the email. Columbia said "no" at least twice. Morrissey knew this. He went ahead and promoted Miley's involvement anyway, did not seem to care about Columbia's denial, did want to promote Miley's involvement for commercial, culture war (and I suppose) artistic reasons, and deeply cared/cares about Miley's own feelings about her inclusion/promotion/ And then he blamed Capitol for withholding the album, while disclosing *none* of those particulars

Wasn't BOT announced as being 'available to the highest/lowest bidder' after it was recorded?

BOT announcement was June 2021. Miley signed to Columbia in April earlier that year. Depending on the time of recording it's possible neither Moz nor Miley were in contract with anyone when they were in the studio.

I doubt Capital had anything to do with the decision to record with Miley.

 

[DaveJCarr]

Sorry, but I’m pretty sure the recordings took place way before Capitol or any label entered the picture.

Yes, but once an artist is signed to a label, said label has the ability to dictate how/when if unreleased tracks/features will be released/promoted so the timetable issue is moot

 

[DaveJCarr]

Hard to say if he genuinely cared about Miley's feelings or if he (naively) saw it as a way to go around the record companies. But claiming to be a victim of a censorship conspiracy... when he knew the truth is pretty hard to stomach. They say that some people who lie profusely actually start to believe the lies they tell - is that the case here?

Morrissey is *always* the hero of his own story, besieged by all manner of malevolent people and cultural forces who refuse to recognize his singular genius and clarion telling of inconvenient truths. At least that's how he (and a significant portion of the fanbase ) see "Mozi"

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Yes, but once an artist is signed to a label, said label has the ability to dictate how/when if unreleased tracks/features will be released/promoted so the timetable issue is moot

Sure. But nowhere in my post (below) that you initially replied to, did I discuss that topic.

I wasn’t blaming anyone.

I was just wondering why Capitol went forward with production before getting Columbias approval.

I wouldn’t feel comfortable coming to that conclusion, since we don’t have the whole story. And probably never will.

I’m interested in why Capitol/Michelle Jubelirer went ahead with production of Veronica or BoT, before getting Columbia’s approval. Which seems to be the case, from the info in the email tweeted.

 

[Crisstti]

Morrissey’s assertion that the wishes of an artist overrule their management and legal beaurocracy implies little to no understanding of the music industry, surely? After 40 years!

He only speaks of her management in that email. Maybe the whole issue with Columbia didn't come into play until later. The email from Columbia published is after all from like 9 months after Moz's email.

 

[Crisstti]

I'm not totally clear... would Capitol have still released BOT without Miley on the record... or do they not want to be involved any longer?

They would have, since they released Rebels. Very probably they don't want to be involved now any longer, after all the drama that's transpired (and we probably don't know half of it).

 

[Malarkey]

He is besieged.

If fans are going to use the same name on multiple platforms - it only takes two seconds to see that they're Tommy Robinson supporters who are against mass immigration.

Some may have been converted in the fanbase - but far more joined the fanbase purely to punt their issue.

You can track them slithering online in greater numbers in 2013, 2015, 2017... interacting with the cousins & the nephew - duping sincere fans into sharing damaging material - harassing hacks in a way that confirmed every accusation made against him - pushing out left-wing & moderate fans - putting the worst spin on anything he said - with only a couple of eyebrow raising mentions of Donnie Knutson until he fell out with Alain & Gus & blocked them from "Morrissey's" Instagram account.

Which does make him look like a sneaky little scumbag.

It just does.

If Donnie insists on clinging on - maybe he could get his client's career back on track? Instead of hammering more nails into his coffin.

 

[TheSmiths_1985]

Poor, innocent, naive, never ever wrong Mozi has never been afraid of ditching band mates, song-writing partners, friends, contracts, record labels, gigs, tours. The reason The Tour Manager, SER et al (but not Al) are still around is because Morrissey likes them. Get over it, Nerak. He’s not the same fey, left-wing bookworm you fell in love with.

 

[stux]

The deal to release Bonfire was clearly compromised on the very first message that Morrissey announced it. This was the first message and he shot himself in the foot. I’ve always wondered why Capitol never announced the deal or put him in their artist roster but the sad fact is Morrissey ignored everything and announced Miley is on the record the first time he mentioned it.

RELEASE - MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY - MORRISSEY CENTRAL - RELEASE

MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY on MORRISSEY CENTRAL

www.morrisseycentral.com

 

[Malarkey]

The deal to release Bonfire was clearly compromised on the very first message that Morrissey announced it. This was the first message and he shot himself in the foot. I’ve always wondered why Capitol never announced the deal or put him in their artist roster but the sad fact is Morrissey ignored everything and announced Miley is on the record the first time he mentioned it.

RELEASE - MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY - MORRISSEY CENTRAL - RELEASE

MESSAGES FROM MORRISSEY on MORRISSEY CENTRAL

www.morrisseycentral.com

And that doesn't have his name on it.

I wonder if all the "banned" & Satanism garbage was useful because yet again his "pr" had lost him a deal.

Edit: I don't actually wonder.

What I do wonder is what state his accounts are in & did this mess give the management a side hustle? Can't get you an interview, but use the footage, I'll put it on Central.... kinda thing.

 

[gashonthenail]

He is besieged.

If fans are going to use the same name on multiple platforms - it only takes two seconds to see that they're Tommy Robinson supporters who are against mass immigration.

Some may have been converted in the fanbase - but far more joined the fanbase purely to punt their issue.

You can track them slithering online in greater numbers in 2013, 2015, 2017... interacting with the cousins & the nephew - duping sincere fans into sharing damaging material - harassing hacks in a way that confirmed every accusation made against him - pushing out left-wing & moderate fans - putting the worst spin on anything he said - with only a couple of eyebrow raising mentions of Donnie Knutson until he fell out with Alain & Gus & blocked them from "Morrissey's" Instagram account.

Which does make him look like a sneaky little scumbag.

It just does.

If Donnie insists on clinging on - maybe he could get his client's career back on track? Instead of hammering more nails into his coffin.

omg is that the 'narrative' you are spinning in your head? If anything can be described as a 'conspiracy theory' it is what you have posted above.

 

[Malarkey]

omg is that the 'narrative' you are spinning in your head? If anything can be described as a 'conspiracy theory' it is what you have posted above.

Aye, Gash except the stupid arseholes posted it all on the internet.

Including a crushingly boring blog written by a sociopath that wittered on about Morrissey loving conspiracy theories & hoped to use the success of the harmlessly unhinged Diana-Morrissey Phenomenon as a model for getting attention.

 

[stux]

And that doesn't have his name on it.

I’m not an expert in non-repudiation but I would say it does have his name on it.

It isn’t a fan site posting leaked or theories about who is doing what. It is his official online presence and it has a section called “Messages from Morrissey” a place where he has posted video and text messages, expressed grief, offered condolence. Whether he actually typed the thing in or not he cannot walk away from the fact this is him.

I also think he is 100% happy with the communication, even to this day, I doubt he regrets a thing about the message. I do get why he wants it his way and I get why he is reluctant to change the song but he was going against the request from Columbia. He then put himself and Capitol in a very difficult spot.

 

[Malarkey]

I’m not an expert in non-repudiation but I would say it does have his name on it.

It isn’t a fan site posting leaked or theories about who is doing what. It is his official online presence and it has a section called “Messages from Morrissey” a place where he has posted video and text messages, expressed grief, offered condolence. Whether he actually typed the thing in or not he cannot walk away from the fact this is him.

I also think he is 100% happy with the communication, even to this day, I doubt he regrets a thing about the message. I do get why he wants it his way and I get why he is reluctant to change the song but he was going against the request from Columbia. He then put himself and Capitol in a very difficult spot.

He's made the decision to sign some statements - so it can be understood that other people write the posts without his name.

There was also a row with the press when something posted by his then manager on his Facebook page under his name was wrongly attributed to him. That instance got sorted out - but mostly journalists can't get anyone to clarify.

 

[BurgerButt]

Morrissey was probably second only to Paul McCartney as the most respected singer / songwriter on the planet. The guy has written some of the greatest songs ever recorded in the history of pop / rock music. Many of us here (myself included) were fortunate enough to see The Smiths play live. I bought their debut record the day it came out no kidding! It is sad to see the current state of Morrissey. He was simply so extraordinary and still is this very day. It is sad to see him groveling over Miley Cyrus for gods sake and targeting the CEO of Capitol records which is one of the most prestigious record companies on the planet (and there are not many left). Scott (his former agent) said he had a great team behind him and that all he needed to do was re-record the track with another even better singer. If he would have taken his advice, BOT would have been released, and Morrissey would be one step ahead of the Stones with the production. As it stands, he does cover songs of Country singers and plays tired setlists that he has rehashed a thousand times with a vast back catalog that stretches for miles. But, Carmen kicks ass (no matter what anyone says) and by all the accounts Morrissey's voice is in top form and from those that have been to the shows by all accounts says the band and Moz sounds great and that they had a splendid evening.

Come on, we all love the Smiths and Moz but to 90% of the worlds population that have heard of either, he's a twat, miserable sod, guy that can't even sing and just drones on etc etc.

I do agree with the rest of your post though.

Morrissey (and his nephew) are Morrissey's worst enemy

 

[Crisstti]

This might have been covered, but when this Ron Perry guy from Columbia emailed Scott Rodger saying "it shouldn't have gone to production without Columbia approval" this seems to imply that at some point Capitol were going ahead with the release even though they'd been told not to (assuming "gone to production" refers to the release process and not the recording process)? Were Capitol at some point going ahead with the release thinking they could clear up the contractual problems along the way, only to find that they couldn't? This would make even less sense of Morrissey blaming Capitol for blocking the release!

It has to, since the album was recorded before the Capitol deal.
And it would seem they asked Columbia early on and they said no... and they went ahead with the production process anyway. Maybe as you say they thought they could clear up the contractual issues along the way, or maybe Columbia's answer wasn't too definitive (could have been along the lines of "not right now" as in the later email). Maybe their lawyers told them that since the recording had happened before Miley's contract then Columbia couldn't stop them? Not too sure how that would work. Maybe when Columbia issued the cease and desist letter Capitol thought they shouldn't risk it.
Morrissey could have disagreed with this or thought they could have negotiated further (offered a fee?) or could have waited until Miley's album had been out for a while.

Who knows what else happened after this.

 

[stux]

It has to, since the album was recorded before the Capitol deal.
And it would seem they asked Columbia early on and they said no... and they went ahead with the production process anyway.

In the tweet that Scott sent he says Columbia only asked for Miley not to be credited as a featured artist. So someone did some negotiation and at least got them to compromise from their earlier position of “we are not clearing anything for MC right now”.

Capitol assumed we were all good to go, planned releases, probably had all sorts of things lined up like a bonus edition with bonus tracks, digital booklets. Mr Omega was probably right all along…

But then Morrissey central announces the deal, the release date and Miley. A phone then rings at Capitol “hi, it’s Columbia records, we had agreed……”

 

[stux]

I’m gutted I missed the opportunity to write:

Morrissey posts the news on central and then …… Sure enough the telephone rings.

booyah.